View Full Version : Stop building black boards!

17th October 2011, 03:53 AM
I'd just like you to know I'm genuinely scared! I invested more than 2000 Euros on a lovely, sleek superlight Phantom 380 board and I am now horrified! No matter how good care I take of it (believe me, I am no teenager throwing it around), it seems to be willing to make a new hole very time I get it in the water! Plus, I can't leave it anywhere near a winter's sun, as the slightest sunray gets its dark grey body warming up pretty quickly and opening the valve makes a "TSCHHHHHH" sound that sounds pretty worrying. No delamination so far but I would definitely not mind 200 grams of extra weight if it was to be painted white. I wonder if insurance covers delamination. Apart from that, the board ROCKS!

17th October 2011, 07:34 AM
I seem to be getting some distortion on the bottom of my 2011 (black) fantom 380. I have sent pictures to my dealer and am waiting for a response.
Some interesting notes:
When purchased, the board bottom was NOT uniformly grey, but had areas showing a black cross hatch about 2cm apart on a bias of about 45degrees. This was not over the entire bottom but in about 5 areas about 10cm wide and 50cm long. At the time the finish felt smooth over these areas.
after about 2 months of use in Ontario Canada, I noticed that I could feel the black pattern and it appeared very slightly raised. In one particular spot, there was a small "blister" forming.
I then contacted the dealer who agreed to send my photos to Starboard.
Do other owners have this black crosshatching?
Is this common? Is this a significant problem? What causes this to happen?

Please advise.

17th October 2011, 10:34 PM
I have a thread in the other forum about the grey paint falling of Isonic 127 2011. It is under the board where the black ruff surface is shown at about 30 x 1 cm. There is also signs of other crack in the paint.

This and the thing that I had a big all-over-nose-crack first day with the board do not make me so impressed of it!

20th October 2011, 10:21 PM
They will carry on building them whilst people carry on buying them !!!

Price of boards is getting crazy !!! Cut one open and just look what you are getting for your money !!!

A block of polystyrene with minimal Carbon /kevlar in it !!! Reckon we are being taken for a ride !!!

7 kg of material costing 1500 ????? Not bad return on that !!! Its all those sponsored sailors more than cost of materials !!!!

22nd October 2011, 12:23 AM
They will carry on building them whilst people carry on buying them !!!

Price of boards is getting crazy !!! Cut one open and just look what you are getting for your money !!!

A block of polystyrene with minimal Carbon /kevlar in it !!! Reckon we are being taken for a ride !!!

7 kg of material costing 1500 ????? Not bad return on that !!! Its all those sponsored sailors more than cost of materials !!!!

So- you'd rather not have any sponsored riders developing your brand's boards?

That sounds like a great plan!

23rd October 2011, 03:03 AM
Its very naive to think sponsored sailors have anything to do with board development !

Sponsored sailors job is to brain wash other sailors !!!

23rd October 2011, 11:03 PM
Saw a broken starboard other day . Was shocked to see the lack of material (except expanded foam) in it..

There were no stringers ; the bottom laminate was woefully thin... I really was shocked .

Was a kode 94 which I thought should have been a bit heavier built ???

24th October 2011, 11:38 PM
Wonder what is the real gain in brushing/sanding boards to let the outer layer show through the painting: 200 grams? Personally I find some models really ugly. I would also prefer at thicker, more resilient shell. I like a board to be light but when you make a ding each time you pull it out of the bag, well... it sucks. Maybe honeycomb sandwich will make its great return as carbon becomes unaffordable. My Fanatic Ultra Rat (108L) was ~8 kg naked and rock solid twenty years ago.

25th October 2011, 11:20 AM
And 20 years ago my Fanatic Ultra Rat snapped on it's first outing in chop

Looked nice though

25th October 2011, 02:03 PM
You must have been unlucky then, hope you got it exchanged under warranty. Mine was a 1992 model. I sailed it for about five years in choppy places like Leucate and made only one/two dings, easily repaired. I sold it because I was considering to quit windsurfing (but took over after a few months). Had also the Ultra Gecko 265, nice board too.

26th October 2011, 01:07 AM
My second homemade customboard in styrofoam and epoxy built 30 years ago is used almost every year since 1981. It is now been used by my eighbour and it has been laying out near the beach last 20 years from april until october. As far as to the start of the season 2011 the 30 year old board has less damage than my Isonic carbon 2011, wich has one nosecrack, two small holes, one line about 30 x 1 cm black surface with no paint and some small cracks in paint. What a development in building boards!

26th October 2011, 08:04 AM
What a bunch of moaners.
My three year old Evil Twin 70 has been around the world and bashed about and jumped high on port and starboard tacks and is still going strong.
For sure, it's not heavy like the old dogs of yesteryear, but I look after it and it lasts

26th October 2011, 08:09 PM
That's the secret: look after it, though I wonder if you coudn't damage some boards but just looking at them. Maybe we will see the weight increase again (slightly) in the coming years. Old dogs of yesterday were not so heavy if you think about it, at least no more than the latest Futura Wood. IMHO modern shapes would not be much less fun with an extra 300 gr.

26th October 2011, 09:51 PM
I have an New Waves costom built circa 1987.. Reckon its stronger than most boards currently on market,It has no carbon or Kevlar in it;in fact I don t think its even epoxy; think its a ployester lay up on glass fibre woven roving. Its not that heavy (8.5 k???) and you can distincly see the two stringers running its full lengthy. it was abused for at leat 5 years and still looks perfectly usable. Its survived countless flat landings and was once waashed up in bvig waves over rocks with minimal damage. !!!

Leave modern boards on beach for 10 mins and there`s a holew in them. Do a flat landing and they snap !

But its our ownb faults !! We have insisted on buying carbon/kevlar/technora/Australioan Pine and a whole host of other exotic BS when materials for best boarsds have been with us for 40 years or more...

Where did polyethylene go ???? Had Tiga Wave and a HiFly Extreme both of which were almost indestructable !! And for their time sailed fantastic.... Are we really saying all of us need boards built to the absolute minimum weight ??? Dont think so?? We just like to think we do !!

Polyethylene /GRP woulkd be fine for 95% of us but we dont buy it because sponsored sailors dont use it !

We lkike to think we need a Ferrari when actually we really need Ford Mondeos.....

(My Syncro Red Dot looks older than the custom New Waves !!!! its had a third of the use !!!)

Manufacturers supply the demand !!! (But they manipulate it !!!)

28th October 2011, 02:11 AM
After some years building bords in the early 80:ties with stringers we found out that styrofoam 3 x glasfibre on top and 2 x glasfibre on bottom, epoxy and styrofoam was good enough. 25-30 years later you can say it definetly was, even without stringers. Weight between 7-8 kilos. What is the weight-problem?

28th October 2011, 05:01 AM
Black is the new colour. I don't mind black that has carbon content - seems authentic. Black is a good colour for wet suits in cold weather. But black cars that can't be seen on the road!

28th October 2011, 09:09 AM
Isn't this the trend happening to most things you buy these days? Tv, washing machine, fridge etc used to last 10 to 20 years. Now, you're lucky if they still work after the warranty period.

Maybe one day we will have cheap and disposable boards! Auto disintegrate after your vacation ;-)

28th October 2011, 10:39 AM
May be not. In the early days of TV there was a thriving market for repair work. Like most things digital technology has brought more reliability and modular repair. Motor cars used to be built like tanks but still broke down (OK simple to fix, but often). Many products are junked while they still work because of newer designs or technological improvements including safety so at what point do we sweat the durability factor?

1st November 2011, 06:44 AM
Hmm. not sure what this has to do with ultra thin black boards, but...
The cars that were built like tanks indeed broke down and rusted away. Now, cars won't sell if they break down. Neither will boards if they have no durability. The truth will out.
The fashion thrust in boards is making them too expensive and at the same time less durable.

18th January 2012, 01:52 AM
Its not the color, starboard just makes crappy boards.

19th January 2012, 02:08 AM
monocoque stucture needs little reinforcement for alot of strenght, add more layers of glass and you get very little actual structural gain with more weight.
the issue with the large phantom is lots of surface area to cover, an small increase of a laminate = a large increase in weight!
but saying this i bet a bit more weight wouldnt hurt for the small boards, but dont complain if a boards breaks after a smash against a rock or sailed over sunken refridgerators !

the phantom however is an all out raceboard , get the phantom 320 instead if you are worried about dings. my friend has a mistral equipe and a mistral superlight 2, the superlight two is fragile , way more then the equipe same shape but a wee bit less weight.
sailors it your choice!