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Guest
5th August 2007, 02:17 AM
It seems that I am breaking alot of Harness lines. Dakine,Chinook all the same about 10 sessions and the line breaks. The tubing is in perfect condition. Any ideas on better line to use?

The webbing is fine it can be reused time after time... Any help would be appreciated...Thanks, Michael McEleroy...

steveC
5th August 2007, 04:02 AM
Hi Michael,

What kind of harness spreader/hook are you using? Also, what's your weight?

I'm surprised that you're getting such poor serviceablity and longevity out of your lines. While I haven't been tracking how long my lines last, reflecting back over the years, I get quite a bit of use before failure. The result is the same though, as the line breaks before the plastic tubing or the attachment webbing fails. However, to clarify a bit, the break in the line always occurs in the area where the harness hook comes in contact with the line. Although I'm not really a heavy sailor (about 70kgs), I have a rich history of breaking boom front ends, so I must be putting a lot of pressure on the harness lines while sailing.

Roger
5th August 2007, 07:22 AM
Hi Michael,
Have you considered a Reactor Bar roller hook vs whatever hook you are using?
Then your lines will last forever (or until the webbing or the velcro tabs wear out or fall off).
I would also check your harness hook for a sharp edge that may not cut the tubing, but it's cutting the line.
Back when I used alminum harness hooks I had several that wore in the hook area to a sharp radius that didn't cut the tubing, but cut the line. They also "jammed" so the line did not slide easily as the radius was the same diameter as the line.
Now I use Dakine roller hooks (can't get the original Reactor Bars any more) and my harness lines last several seasons of fairly hard demo use.
Check out the inside radius of your harness hook and any adjacent areas that come in contact with your harness lines. There's a sharp edge on something that's wearing/damaging/cutting you harness lines.
Do you leave your rigs in the wash at the edge of the water alot?
Sand that gets washed into the lines can cause premature wear.
Where are your lines breaking?
Right in the middle where they contact the hook or somewhere else?
Hope this helps,

Guest
5th August 2007, 09:42 PM
The lines are wearing right in the middle of the line from wear, The stainless hook seems fine,no burrs. I will try the reactor bar....I only weigh 165LBs....

steveC
5th August 2007, 11:53 PM
Hi Michael,

Very curious indeed. Based on your original post, you indicated that the webbing was fine and could be reused. Are the style of lines you are using the kind where you have to tie on the line to the webbing? If so, have you tried the basic fixed lines where either end of the line is actually sown right to the webbing? The basic sown fixed lines are less apt to allow in sand, and there's less chance of movement between the line and the plastic tubing.

Roger's suggestion of switching to a reactor bar type design just might be your salvation here. I actually prefer the SS hook design, because the roller assembly would evidently wear out, but you might just find the roller hook really works best for you.

If all else fails, you might want to consider investigating using SS cable inside the plastic tubing. It's usually available at most marine chandlerys, like West Marine or Boater's World. While I've never seen anyone use SS cable for harness lines, I think a lightweight small diameter cable should have enough flexibility and strength to be workable, and there are plenty of different types of marine SS components to successfully terminate either end.

Roger
6th August 2007, 02:28 AM
Hi Steve,
We had 1/8" SS cable lines (inside a farily hard plastic tube way back in the day. Made by "Whitecaps" (Peter Jones) is I remember correctly.
They worked, but as I remember the crimped loops on the ends eventually failed.
Ever tried a roller hook? Corrosion (on the original Reactor Bars that were painted, not powder coated 6000 series aluminum) was the only thing that caused a problem. I have my original, and the aluminum is very corroded, but the roller assembly still works fine. Lots of bearing area inside the roller and the roller lasts forever.
I did a search and found that Reactor Bars are still made, I'm just not sure where to buy the originals. I think they've licensed the original patent to DaKine.
Here's a link to the original Reactor Bar....
http://www.alliedti.com/reactor.php

steveC
7th August 2007, 12:31 AM
Hi Roger,

I bought one Reactor Bar, and in fact, I still have it stored away with a number of old odds and ends I never use any more, like an ancient aluminum mast tip extender for a gray Ampro mast. My Reactor Bar was one of the painted ones, so it ultimately corroded terribly after the paint started flaking off. As I alluded to earlier, the roller assembly eventually wore to a point where the plastic roller started getting a bit wobbly on its shaft, and that's when I retired it. Also, I found that the punched-out slots at either end readily ate through the main webbing strap of my harness. All these issues just soured me on the whole Reactor Bar concept, and I happily went back to the SS spreaders with the hook.

That's interesting that SS cable lines were once commercially available. When suggesting the concept to Michael, I was trying to think of something that could easily be constructed from common components and seemingly would be bulletproof. Yet, even SS in some applications can ultimately fatigue to the point of failure. I guess nothing lasts forever.

Roger
7th August 2007, 12:54 AM
Hi Steve,
Way back when, when I still lived out in Calif. I wrote to the Reactor bar guys about the sharp edges where the strap gets cut/chafed, and recommended that they run aradius cutter around the slots on both sides, plus I recommended a conversion coating under the paint to slow down the corrosion. This was about the time they converted to powder coating, and my subsequent DaKine Reactor bars seem to last a whole lot longer. I did once replace the roller with the new "kit" that Reactor put out with a new screw, a new axle, and 3 different roller shapes.
R

Guest
13th August 2007, 02:44 AM
Do you guys/gals have the problem of the roller hook popping out in choppy conditions?:(

Roger
13th August 2007, 03:58 AM
Hi Guest,
If your line comes out of the hook, you don't have your lines short enough, or you are not really committing all you weight to the harness.
Raise your boom, shorten your lines, take more weight off your board.
I use Reactors with both waist and seat harnesses and I have never had this problem unless I had my lines set too long.
Since I use the Sailworks "Quick Tune" adj. harness lines, I can fix this problem "on the fly".
Hope this helps,

Guest
13th August 2007, 04:36 AM
Roger: Thank you! for the advice, I will try shortening my lines next time out and let you know....John Stemler............:D

Roger
13th August 2007, 11:08 PM
Hi Guest,
Thinking this through a little further, what type of harness (waist or seat) are you using, how big is your chop, and what size/type board and rig are you using.
This may also be partially a "too much use of the arms" issue or some sort of stance issue.
If you have your lines too short, and don't have your arms fully extended, then the primary issue is that you are still "using your arms to take the pull" of the rig. Try to lean back more, get your arms fully extended (maybe even with your shoulders "rolled in" some) so that you cantilever your weight as far from the rig as possible.
Combine this with allowing the board to rise and fall over the chop, with your legs acting as shock absorbers (think of mogul skiing here)
there will be a constant and steady pressure on the harness lines and hook so you should have no inadvertent "hook popping out" incidents.
Also is the type of harness you are using and the stance you are using do not match the board and the conditions, you could be "standing up" a little too tall and keeping your body in a little closer to the rig than necessary. This would reduce the harness line pressure and put a little too much weight on the back of the board, which may cause the board to bounce over the chop more than normal.
Steady mast foot pressure and learning to "suspend" your entire body weight off the harness; harness hook; and rig will keep you hooked in, through the chop. When you achieve this, all the drive of the rig goes into the mast foot, and you are providing the couner balancing forces to keep the rig driving through the mast foot.
Hope this helps,

Unregistered
20th August 2007, 06:54 AM
I took the Dakine roller hook and bent the end down about 30 degrees.First I took off the plastic roller as not to melt it than I used a blow torch for about 20 seconds on the end of the protruding metal. With the angle the roller never pops out.........

Unregistered
23rd August 2007, 02:48 AM
I wonder why Dakine doe not do that from the factory? Makes more sense to me seeing that a regular hook is bent........