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Jay
9th September 2007, 03:09 PM
Does anyone know a source where I can get some Australian Pine to match the wood decks in my Starboards?

Is there any way it can be ordered directly from Starboard?

Thanks!

Jay

Ola_H
9th September 2007, 05:07 PM
Ordering directly is probably problematic, but your importer/shop can order spare sheets in a4 size.

Jay
10th September 2007, 02:41 PM
Thanks, Ola, I'll give that a try.

Ola_H
10th September 2007, 04:41 PM
Get back if it does not work out.

Jay
12th September 2007, 01:45 PM
Thanks, Ola, you are very kind.
What great people Starboard has supporting it's customers.
That is one reason why I am a loyal customer!

prsurf
18th September 2007, 06:58 AM
Get back if it does not work out.

Ola,

I have checked and it does not seem to be an easy task to get Aus Pine replacements... I am still awaiting a response from 2x shops (it has been many days). Pls advise, as when you need them it is tough to have to make do w/o and keep the board value and performance intact... Can you ship directly?

Thanks

Ola_H
18th September 2007, 07:14 AM
I think it is pretty much impossible to ship directly. The next best thing would be to contact your importer by phone. Where are you located?

Unregistered
18th September 2007, 05:46 PM
wood is a pain in the ass if something goes wrong...

Mike T
18th September 2007, 11:41 PM
Jay
Are you doing a repair to the deck of the board? Here is a place that might be able to help with pine veneer. Also Check out the Board Lady web site for repairs info. Good luck. Mike T


http://www.veneersupplies.com/

steveC
19th September 2007, 01:10 AM
Hi Mike T,

Hey, thanks for posting the veneer website. No doubt, lots of interesting products for projects.

prsurf
19th September 2007, 04:51 AM
I think it is pretty much impossible to ship directly. The next best thing would be to contact your importer by phone. Where are you located?

Ola, I live in Miami and have contacted the guys at Trident and am waiting for an answer. I understand they are the importer for North America... hopefully, they will have an answer.

Thanks

Ola_H
19th September 2007, 02:35 PM
OK. I just thought that if you were in closer to Sweden. I could just send you a sheet from my private stash directly.

Jay
19th September 2007, 02:39 PM
Mike, yes I am doing a wood deck repair. Thanks for the link, I'll check them out.
I would prefer to get the same wood that Starboard uses for a better match if possible.

Prsurf, I asked my dealer to look into getting some - I guess they will be checking with Trident also. When you hear back from them please post the results (I'll do the same if I hear first). If they get enough inquiries they will be more motivated to make an effort - hey, it can't be a big deal for them to order it for us! I'm sure Starboard will support us.

Ola_H
19th September 2007, 03:23 PM
In the order form available to Trident there is a "wood repair kit" consisting of 10 sheets in a4 (approx 20*30cm, 8*12") size. It's not expensive either so I see no reason why they could not include a few such kits in their next order (if they don't have it in stock already).

Mike T
20th September 2007, 11:12 PM
Jay
Hi! Here is something to take a look at as far as a repair for your wood deck. Not sure If you had a chance to look a Eva's web site. Good luck! Mike T
www.boardlady.com/floweryheartbreak.htm

Jay
21st September 2007, 04:59 AM
Ola - Thanks, I'll be sure to tell my dealer. That's an excellent sign it can be obtained.

Mike - Thanks, I've already seen that. Good stuff. For the minor repairs I've got my basic skills down but I need the right materials or it's a waste of time!

prsurf
25th September 2007, 07:35 PM
In the order form available to Trident there is a "wood repair kit" consisting of 10 sheets in a4 (approx 20*30cm, 8*12") size. It's not expensive either so I see no reason why they could not include a few such kits in their next order (if they don't have it in stock already).

Ola,

Sorry to be so persistent, but I have not received any reply from Trident in almost a week. I called and left msg and subsequently sent an email. When I spoke with them they did not seem to find what you were referring to... I am at a loss, as I need to perform the repair but hate to fill the top ding with epoxy as this will decrease the value of the board and may also impact performance. Can you help, or maybe point me to someone who can assist? Again, I am ready to order the kit... but find no easy way to do it...

Ola_H
25th September 2007, 08:46 PM
prsurf, I don't have any contact with Trident as I'm basically "just a rider". But if they can find the 2008 accessory order form (excel file) they should look at line 98 for the part labeled

STGA08WRS 2008 Wood repair shets (A4 size)

If worse comes to worse, I'll send you a sheet by mail from my personal stash. Call Trident one more time and then drop me a line by mail ola.helenius@ncm.gu.se. I don't have that many though and can't supply the whole USA so it really would be better of Trident ordered some.

Mike T
26th September 2007, 08:51 AM
Jay
How big is the repair that you need to do and what is the location of the ding? Also how bad is it? Do you have a soft spot or crunshing sound if you press down on the area? Because if you hear crunching sounds you most likely crushed some of the core. That would have to be fixed before you can do the wood other wise its a waste of time to just put wood over it with epoxy. Not sure if you have seen this epoxy from System Three but it's very clear like water and It's very easy to work with. www.systemthree.com/p_sb_112.asp Here is another place for veneers, www.woodcraft.com not sure if you have a store in your area but you could take the board to the store and see if they can match up a veneer piece for you. The store we have here they are quite helpfull. They might come up with a clever way of hiding the ding.They would probably be amazed that you have a wood board! When I took my stand-up Paddle into the store the guys jaw hit the floor! (SB SUP Forum) Just another Idea. Good Luck. Mike T

Jay
26th September 2007, 01:29 PM
Mike, thanks for your input. The damage on my board is a crescent shaped dent from my harness hook. It must have happened when I blew a tack and fell off the bow. The blunt harness hook (U shaped end) crushed the wood deck in the shape of the end of the hook but did't do any other damage. So just a crescent shaped depresseion a little over an inch long or so and maybe several 3-4 mm wide. It depressed the wood 3-4 mm down and probably did break through the inner glass (I'm assuming there is inner glass). Actually that raises a question - on the starboard wood decked boards I wonder if you or anyone else knows if there's inner glass and outer glass sandwiching the wood veneer? I've always assumed there are both but I read somewhere that there may be no outer glass, just resin soaking the wood. I'm not even sure if there is inner glass so any input would be appreciated.

Roger recommended that to repair this I apply penetrating epoxy to seal the wood deep down (after drying), then use a filler (wood putty or epoxy mixed with wood dough), and then glass over that. I'm assuming that since it's such a small area (not a tiny ding but not a huge defect either) that I wouldn't have to get into digging into the core to inspect or repair it. How does this approach sound to you?

Thanks again!

Jay
26th September 2007, 01:39 PM
Mike, I forgot to mention in reference to your other questions: the board is a Serenity and the ding is on the wood veneer on the side of the board towrads the bow a couple of inches from the foam deck pad maybe a foot back from the bow end of that pad. It's not big enough to get my finger into it (too narrow) so I can't tell if there's a crunching sound.

That SystemThree epoxy does look great and Woodcraft is good to know about, thanks. Another way to get a clear epoxy that I know of is to use West System 105 resin with their 207 hardener. That hardener is designed to be clear and go over wood such as boat decks or canoes. It incorporates a UV protectant which is good since many don't. I'd still use a UV polyurethane over any epoxy to be safe. Regardless, that SystemThree looks potentially even better since it was designed for surf and windsurf boards. Thankis!

Mike T
27th September 2007, 10:25 PM
Jay
Just a recommendation on you ding repair, Roger's idea will work fine. I would sand the are of the ding very light on the sanding with maybe 150 grit sand paper, Just enough sanding to get the clear coat that SB use to seal the wood off and to rough up the area for the epoxy to stick, sand a little out side of the ding let say a 1/4". Wipe the area with rubbing alcohol to make sure it's clean. Then cut a pieces of 4oz surfboard glass a little bit larger and the same shape as the ding. Cut out maybe two more pieces of glass getting progessivly smaller. Then what ever resin you deside to use mix up a small amout of resin and then transfer the resin to a larger cup so it doesnt get hot and it gives you more time before the epoxy kicks.
Using an acid brush brush on some epoxy to the wood and let it soak in, if it looks dry after a short time add a little more. Once the wood won't take anymore epoxy lay the larger piece of glass on the ding. Let the cloth soak up any excess epoxy. If it's still white and not clear add a small amout of epoxy with the acid brush, then just add the other layer of glass and repeat. You shoud have a nice clear layer of glass and epoxy. You should see the weave of the cloth and the glass should lay against the wood not float in the epoxy. Let it dry for 24hrs. Then wet sand the area with 320 grit, and dry and clean with Alcohol. Mix up a small amout of epoxy and fill the weave and any pin holes. This should give you a strong light repair and it won't be to noticable. Good luck! Mike T

Jay
28th September 2007, 01:45 PM
Thanks, Mike. I appreciate your input.
I can see that there's an art to board repair, with trade-offs regarding strength, weight, cosmetics, and work.

Mike T
28th September 2007, 10:17 PM
Jay
Your right about the trade-off but if you take your time and and do it slowly you can do repairs that are pretty close to invisiable. The big thing is be patiant and don't rush the job. It takes time to do it right. The one thing a friend tought me about board repairs back in the early 1980 (West-Wind Glass boards days). Once you apply the resin and the cloth and you've got any excess resin off walk away from it and let it cure. Don't fiddle with it. You can always sand it later and then apply more resin to fill the weave and a little extra to sand off and buff to a nice finish. Also with these clear epoxy's you can buff them to a nice shine by wet sanding them with 400,600,800&1000 grit wet sanding paper misted with soapy water and them some car wax scratch remover. good luck Mike T

Jay
29th September 2007, 01:14 PM
Mike, thanks for the additional pointers.
When I read Eva the Board Lady's site (and also I watched the West System DVD) I think they recommended using a small plastic squeege with light pressure once you've saturated the glass similar to the method you described (ie, letting the cloth absorb limited resin and avoiding excess). Another method shown involved using "peel ply" (nylon cloth that won't adhere to epoxy) which is laid over the saturated glass and then squeegied and finally peeled off once the resin cures. I'm curious if you've ever tried these methods and if you think the method you describe is preferable. I've tried the simple squeegee technique before and it worked well but you have to be careful not to disturb the fibers at the edges of the cloth or to move the cloth. It did result in what appeared to be an optimal resin to glass matrix (still requireing a final resin coat to fill the cloth weave). You do have to be carefull to keep excess resin off the adjoining area. Masking worked well for that but there is a little leaking under the tape if there's non-skid.

Roger
29th September 2007, 10:13 PM
Hi Jay,
If you had a vacuum pump, you could use the peel ply with a perforated barrier cloth and an absorbent layer on the out side to get the correct "wetting" out of your glass.
That's pretty much what Eva, Boeing, and all the other "composites pros" do.
Without the vacuum pump, you can use tape on dings on the rails to achieve something similar and sandbags or other weights on deck dings to compress all the repair products into the damaged area without having an excess of resin.
Hope this helps,

Mike T
30th September 2007, 12:58 AM
Jay
I've done it both ways, with a vacuum pump and with peel ply and absorbent layer and plastic outer layer to seal it up. I've also just layed it out without vacuum bagging, alot depends on the location like Rodger says and if you have the equipment. Your right about the squeegie part sorry for leaving that out, But I figured if you are checking out Eva's web site you probably knew that. Also you can use Plumbers putty as a sealing tape instead of the dumb dumb tape. It works really well to get a seal around the nonskid. Just roll the putty into a long snake and press it into the board. I've also used a automotive vacuum hand pump with a gauge on small repairs. It will suck the film down and will hold a good vacuum when used with the plummers putty. The pump does'nt cost a small fortune either.
My brother in law uses the same thing to fix his I-14 skiff and has made quite a few carbon parts for his boat and new carbon brackets for a telescope.
You can also lay it up like your going to vacuum bag it and weight it down with a sand bag or tape it down. You just have to decide if it's in a high stress area and to what extent you want to invest in all the equipment to do the vacuum bagging gig. If it is in a non high stress area and is pretty small then just go with the simple repair. You can also use peel ply over the repair and squeegie it then this will keep the fibers in place. Tape works to keep excess resin off the surounding area and it keep you from sanding out side of that area your trying to repair. One other thing about the peel ply it will remove any blush from the curing of the epoxy and leaves a slight coarse surface for the final layer of resin to stick too. Just some more info for you. Hope this helps. Mike T

Mike T
30th September 2007, 01:03 AM
Jay
To get the plummers putty up I use a plastic scrapper and then wash the rest off with some soft scrub and a brush to get it out of the nonskid. Mike T

Jay
30th September 2007, 02:17 PM
Roger and Mike, thanks so much for the additional input, great stuff.
When I got into windsurfing I didn't think I would be either interested or able to do these kind of repairs but find it is both fun and practical. For major repairs I'll still get expert help but the hasstle of getting the board to a remote shop makes doing many repairs yourself very attractive. Thanks again!