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SIN_0
24th September 2006, 07:51 PM
tried the 161 today on a 10.5m? in 7-10 kts with the R19 stock fin.

tends to plane earlier than 160. somehow felt better than the 160 in lite air.
still prefer custom fins otherwise stock fin, should be good enough for recreational sailors.

hope the see more post about the 161 soon.

Remi
24th September 2006, 08:42 PM
Hi SIN_0,

If you woild like to increase your performances in light wind again, go for the Deboichet Custom R19.

Waiting for your impression in more wind

All the best

G
24th September 2006, 09:44 PM
SIN_0 why don't you tell us some more?!
How about pointing?
Is a "free" board or similar to 160?
And what about downwind speed and angle?
Come on...

Remi
25th September 2006, 12:25 AM
Hi G,

Ok so this board is really better in all points, and in all wind conditions.
Up wind and down wind angle increase really and the board is again more easy to use. But need really the new Deboichet R 19. The extra power in the tip give an excellent lift.

We have them already in Martinique and we check the difference this week, the F 160 can not follow anymore the F 161 particulary in light wind and strong wind on all tack ,in medium wind the difference is less but steel leading.

All the best

G
25th September 2006, 12:58 AM
Thank you Remi.
Wider tail needs powerfull fin to make the board go.
I hope to be able to use my R17 S too.Do you think it'll be possible?If yes,what will be its range?
Still can't understand how it's possible improve low wind and high wind performance at one time.Would you explain why,please Remi?

Remi
25th September 2006, 05:42 AM
Hi G,

The Formula is a board whoa have to work as best as possible from 7 to 35 knots, so when we try something new we test it in all conditions to be valid. Each we do like this and the F 160 was beter in light wind and Strong wind compare to the F 159. So we continue in the same spirit.

All the best

JW22
25th September 2006, 02:41 PM
Remi,

Do you test 160 against the 161 with same fin (both on R19?) Does the 160 benefit form the R19 also? Maybe the better angles are somehow related to the new fin also? What about comparing 160 with R13 soft against 160 with R19 ? Does R19 setting win then?

As far as i know increasing lightwind performance works contrary to increasing highwind performance so if you guys are able to do both then you are really on a new track :) The Apollo proves though, for a really light wind performing board you guys made a more stretched scoop rocker (among other things) which makes the board less performing in higher winds, yes

Remi
25th September 2006, 06:50 PM
Hi JW22,

We developpe the R19 since 9 month to increase again the performances of the F 161 compare to the F 160. Tha means clearly that the shape of the F 161 was better than the F 160 in all condition with the R 13. But to increase again the performances in light wind the R 19 born.
So of course we try all fin combination and F 161 wining all the time.

"As far as i know increasing lightwind performance works contrary to increasing highwind "

We devellope the Apollo to make an extrem light wind perfomance board with out thinking about high wind. This board is better in light wind but not in strong wind, but if you compare the performances of the F 159 to F 160, easy to see that the F 160 win in all conditions. So we increase the light wind performances and high wind performances.

So the plan now with what we learn from the Apollo, is to make a board who cover the Apollo and the F 161 for next year. So only one board.

All the best

G
25th September 2006, 07:57 PM
Thank you Remi.
Any advice about R19 stiffness and rake for people around 80 kg?
As I've already asked in a post above,would you please tell us if R17 (S) would be right used on 161 and if yes what will be the moment to put it in?
thank you

Remi
26th September 2006, 12:59 AM
Hi G,

We still continue the devellopement to have the best fin for the F 161 and right now the machine is the R 19 soft -- rake + 8cm. Be carefull to be used until 15 knots max. No reason to use it over the R 13 medium rake + 8 cm have more glide over 15 knots.

The R 17 soft is a good fin in stable wind condition, but until you get light unstable wind condition the R 19 is by far better.

All the best

All the best

Remi
26th September 2006, 01:03 AM
Hi G,

We still continue the devellopement to have the best fin for the F 161 and right now the machine is the R 19 soft -- rake + 8cm. Be carefull to be used until 15 knots max. No reason to use it over the R 13 medium rake + 8 cm have more glide over 15 knots.

The R 17 soft is a good fin in stable wind condition, but until you get light unstable wind condition the R 19 is by far better.

All the best

All the best

Remi
26th September 2006, 01:03 AM
Hi G,

We still continue the devellopement to have the best fin for the F 161 and right now the machine is the R 19 soft -- rake + 8cm. Be carefull to be used until 15 knots max. No reason to use it over the R 13 medium rake + 8 cm have more glide over 15 knots.

The R 17 soft is a good fin in stable wind condition, but until you get light unstable wind condition the R 19 is by far better.

All the best

Remi
26th September 2006, 01:08 AM
Hi G,

We still continue the devellopement to have the best fin for the F 161 and right now the machine is the R 19 soft -- rake + 8cm. Be carefull to be used until 15 knots max. No reason to use it over the R 13 medium rake + 8 cm have more glide over 15 knots.

The R 17 soft is a good fin in stable wind condition, but until you get light unstable wind condition the R 19 is by far better.

All the best

SIN_0
26th September 2006, 02:00 PM
no chance to try the 161 in better conditions yet.

however, u do need to buy the biggest (width) board bag for 161.
the board really takes up more space on my car roof rack.

will post my amateur findings when the wind is right again.

G
28th September 2006, 03:03 AM
Hey Remi,if I want re-base my R17S for 161, what rake do I need?
And,buying the R19 S-- for less then 15 kns,later may i use the r17S or will be still better the R13?
Some news from your martinica 161 test?
thank you

Expander
2nd October 2006, 05:24 PM
Remi wrote:

...the machine is the R 19 soft -- rake + 8cm. Be carefull to be used until 15 knots max. No reason to use it over the R 13 medium rake + 8 cm have more glide over 15 knots...

--

Hi Remi,

about R13 M +8 you suggested to use in windy condition, do you think we should select it in 68 or 70 cm size?

Cheers,

- Expander.

Remi
2nd October 2006, 06:18 PM
Hi Expander,

Due to the extrem wide tail, normaly you don't need smaller fin than 70cm. So go for R 13 M rake + 8 or 6cm depend of your weight and level.


All the best

Remi
2nd October 2006, 06:21 PM
Hi G,

I definitely prefer the R13 and R 19 for the F 161, but in case you want to rebase your R 17, go for rake + 8cm.

All the best

Denis GER 189
4th October 2006, 01:56 PM
Hi Remi,

do I understand you right, that you use with the 161

up to 15 knots: R19S-- rake +8
over 15 knots: R13M+ rake +8

Which is the 70cm (!!) fin to use with the Apollo?

BR
Denis

G
4th October 2006, 08:43 PM
It doesn't mean too much but:

Can't really say much about the 161 (appart from the fact that it's an ugly board!!), haven't sailed it, but looking at the results, the podium of the weekend was 159, 159 & 160. The first 161 was 6th and this is the guy that has been winning the series for the past 3-4 years... go figure form that!!!

G
4th October 2006, 08:44 PM
I'm sorry,I've forgotten to say thet it was written in Exocet English forum.

barks
4th October 2006, 08:48 PM
G wrote:
It doesn't mean too much but:
The first 161 was 6th and this is the guy that has been winning the series for the past 3-4 years... go figure form that!!!

It might just mean that he hasn't had time to get the board dialled/trimmed/finned properly yet though. Hard to say, most people I think would aggree that the 160 is better than the 159, but you still se good racers on the 159 finishing very well - probably one reason for this is that they know the board very very well by now. It could also mean that the 161 is a cockup like the TT05, which also tested really well before production, though I don't think so. I'd kinda like to what happens once the best sailers get a few months on the board and gets fin quivers and trim dialled.

Remi
5th October 2006, 07:23 AM
Denis GER 189 wrote:
Hi Remi,

do I understand you right, that you use with the 161

up to 15 knots: R19S-- rake +8
over 15 knots: R13M+ rake +8

Which is the 70cm (!!) fin to use with the Apollo?

BR
Denis

Hi Denis,

Yes it's my favorite fins and the best one for the Apollo at the 70cm limit size is the R 19 soft -- rake + 8cm. But the best one for this board is the R 13 75 soft -- rake + 8cm

All the best

AUS016
5th October 2006, 09:41 AM
You can't read to much into the weekend's results. The boards arrived on Friday, and no one had powerful enough fins to use with them. The Drake is not on par with custom fins

Saturday had very difficult short sharp chop and 20 knots. Not the best conditions for tuning a new board, nevertheless, 161's had many finishes in the top 5.

Where was the Exocet????? ;)

The results and reports are on

www.storm-riders.com.au

SeanAUS120
5th October 2006, 09:50 AM
ok, so these 'results' we're actually talking about were the first event in Sydney for the Australian season. Not everyone had their 161's at this stage, and most had just unwrapped them that morning.

My 160 is on a ship somewhere between Holland and Sydney and my 161 was in a truck somewhere between Sydney and my house. So I used the 159 with R19 S- that weekend. Sweeeeeeeeet fin. The 159 is still a sweet board. Sweet enough to win 6 out of 8 races by a bit, which is why the 161's were a little way behind in the results.

Have had a little while to sail the 161 this week. Remi is right on the money; an R19 is definitely what you want for this board. Makes the board considerably more stable and pointing incredibly high (and suprisingly with the size of this fin, its motoring downwind). So far that's all I've tried with as my fins haven't arrived back from Europe yet... but I'm confident in saying already this is the best starboard formula board I've sailed by far!

raffig
5th October 2006, 07:40 PM
Sorry, but what are the specifications of the stock fin which comes with the 161?

Remi
6th October 2006, 07:40 AM
Hi Raffing,

The stock fin is a copy of the Deboichet R 19 soft -- rake + 8cm.

All the best

raffig
6th October 2006, 03:25 PM
Hello Remi,
I am a bit confused now... In the second post you replied that "If you woild like to increase your performances in light wind again, go for the Deboichet Custom R19", so is this different than the stock fin?

My question is: Is the stock fin competitive for winds up to 15 knots or is it necessary to order another one?

Thanks for your input.

Rafa

Remi
6th October 2006, 06:21 PM
Hi Raffig,

Yes a Custom fin from Deboichet who is a lot more expensive compare to the Stock fin is really better. It's depend of the material you use to make the fin. But for a stock fin the Drake is pretty good and work propely under 15 knots.


All the best

Expander
9th October 2006, 06:18 PM
Remi wrote:

...up to 15 knots: R19S-- rake +8
over 15 knots: R13M+ rake +8...




Hi Remi,

for us, normal racers, don't you think is a big issue for legs to keep board working with +8 rake fins in strong wind ?

I come from F2 and I really would like to switch to Starboard: is 161 more comfortable in windy condition, even with forwarded fins like +8 R13?

And what do you expect in terms of pointing angle with same fin but at +6 rake, instead?

Many thanks.

- Expander.

G
11th October 2006, 08:43 PM
Hey guys (Remi and others owning new 161),some more test of the board? Any news?

Remi
11th October 2006, 09:58 PM
Hi Expander,

If I am not wrong the F2 prefer more angle, but the new F 161 is really extremely easy in strong wind, so no problem with the + 8cm rake angle.

All the best

Expander
16th October 2006, 04:21 PM
Remi wrote:
Hi Expander,

If I am not wrong the F2 prefer more angle, but the new F 161 is really extremely easy in strong wind, so no problem with the + 8cm rake angle.

All the best

--

Thank you, Remi, for your very reliable suggestions.

- Exp.

Guest
21st February 2007, 12:35 AM
Hi guys,
I'm finally trading in my trusty 158 for a newer model

1) Any more views on the 161 vs 160?

2) discussion threads suggest that this board excels in the light. Is the 161 easy to control in high wind? I have visions of this being like the Fanatic T2 i used to have which was a nightmare in strong winds.

3) Are we still set on just 2 fins:
a)70R19S+8 upto 15knots and
b)70R13m+8 for more wind?

4) Has 161 been raced in any competitions yet? if so, how did it do compared to 160, 159 and new F2 etc?

Thanks,
Rich

Krister
21st February 2007, 02:13 AM
Jesper Vesterstrom seems to have killed all the competion in australia, didn't even have to race the last day...

http://www.formulawindsurfing.org/news.php?id=1234