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Peterk
14th October 2006, 01:09 AM
I am looking for a board that can be used in 4.0 to 5.7 conditions here in the Northeast. Most of my sailing is in washing machine like conditions but I do have occassions where waves and certainly huge swells are an option.

I have heard nothing but unbelievable things about the Evo for waves and swells. How will it perform in 3 and 4 foot chop/swells that can hit you from every direction?

Thanks

Peter

Ola_H
14th October 2006, 04:26 AM
What is your weight? How often do you get the wave days and is it onshore or sideshore. Do you live for these days or are they just a nice bonus?

Peterk
14th October 2006, 06:06 AM
I way 168 lbs. I live for the days when it is blowing 25knots or more.

90% of our wave sailing is onshore. I have more opportunities for large swells than waves, although I have a couple of nice wave sailing spots I can go to.

Buzzards Bay can get VERY chopped up when it starts blowing. I sail an old Mistral Challenge Flex that is 8'6" long and about 21" wide. It eats up chop. It turns very well but it is very unforgiving, especially when the wind gets marginal. Don't get me wrong, it is a great shape, very fast and turns beautifully on the waves and swells. But it probably a 16 year old board.

steveC
14th October 2006, 10:08 AM
Hi Peterk,

Given your description of your conditions, you might want to consider the Pure Acid line too. Probably not the optimum design for onshore wavesailing, but it sounds like the choppy B&J might show the PAs style and ability through the mixed swell outside. Not to detract from the EVO here, yet the design alternative is also worth investigating in an important decision. If you're on a 16 year old board, it sounds like your up for a long term decision. Best to consider all possibilities.

Peterk
14th October 2006, 11:06 PM
Steve,

You are right. I will be owning it for a long time. My problem is that I have too many choices available to me. 16 years ago I had no money and was able to buy the Challenge Flex for short money.

I have also learned over the years that you can have a good time on just about any board. My only complaint about my old board, other than it is about to snap in half, is that it is horrible when the wind notches down. The width of the Evo really looks nice, I just wonder how it behaves when the water gets messy. My narrow board takes it no problem. I would say that the shape is similar to that of the acid, which appears very traditional in design.

steveC
15th October 2006, 01:27 AM
Hi Peterk,

Maybe Ola H. will respond again to comment further on the EVO line, as he has always been a strong advocate for them in the past. In the meantime, it might be of value to search some the earlier threads to glean some useful information. Unfortunately, I have no personal experience with the EVOs, but I know others that love their maneuverability, particularly in onshore surf conditions. I have noted that they don't appear to be a super fast in B&J applications, but I think that their design credentials are more seriously focused on maneuverability. I find that most EVO sailors like hanging tough in the surf zone and they aren't as interested in long runs out to sea, but of course that has a lot to do with the folks I know and sail with.

For your applications, you need to consider what would be the most fun overall. That is why I mentioned also considering the more traditional PA line, because it offers an interesting contrast with its faster rockerline, especially if much of the sailing you like includes a lot of the B&J mode. Still, the PA line is very capable in the surf, especially considering more down the line conditions.

But no matter you cut it, going for a higher wind design (EVO or PA) can leave you compromised if the wind seriously drops off. You can balance things quite a bit by targeting the volume range that will bridge into the lighter conditions, but will still be controllable in high winds. Nonetheless, considering one board for 4.0 to 5.7 conditions is a demanding range for any one board, so you could end up with a challenge at either end of the spectrum. If I were you, I would pick the middle ground and pick up a number of fins to help you stretch the boards capabilities in the extremes.

Ola_H
15th October 2006, 04:16 AM
Steve is right, I love the EVOs myself and if I had to sell all my board and only keep, say, 3, I would keep three EVOs. That said, with your conditions, if your not totally dedicated towards wave riding (which I am) I think and Pure Acid or Kombat would be a better choice. Don't be fooled by their appearance - they are not at all traditional but rather super modern fast wave boards. No doubt an EVO will let you rip frontside turns in your conditions better than anything, but it is less natural in a straightline. This can be tuned with a bigger fin, but Pure Acids and Kombats turns beatifully too and are VERY natural in any kind of B&J setting. It is however a bit difficult to predict how you will appreciate the different boards since your current board is so differnt from any modenr board. I can go deeper into how the different boards ride if you want to. Regarding control in high wind they handle this in different ways, but thay all handle it well. For example, I have no heistations whatsoever to use my EVO 70 in powered up 3.5 conditions (and I'm 69kg)

4.0 to 5.7 is a pretty big span of sails as Steve writes and regardless of which board you chooses you should come back and ask for some advice on extra fins. At 168 lbs I think you will be looking at EVO 74 (or possibly 80), PA 80 or Kombat 79. If you're willing to sacrifice a fair bit of 5.7 performance you can go for the EVO 70 (or 74) or PA 74.

My guess however, is that a Kombat 79 is the safest bet. The Kombats are simply amazing all round boards and are super nice in waves too.

Peterk
15th October 2006, 04:47 AM
I was orignally considering the Kombat. I have no problem sacrificing on the 5.7 end since I own a carve 145 and i plan on getting a Starsurfer S for my kids. I figure when it is 6.0ish I wil steal the Starsurfer. It looks like it would be a lot of fun. It appears to be an oversized Kombat with padding.

Screamer
15th October 2006, 07:22 PM
Hi Peterk

Here are a couple of older threads discussing differences between these boards:

http://www.star-board.com/forum/viewthread.php?forum_id=6&thread_id=12598
http://www.star-board.com/forum/viewthread.php?forum_id=5&thread_id=18381

Btw, I don't think that either C145 or starsurfer will be fun in 5.7-6m weather (too wide in my opinion).

Bye

clovus
16th October 2006, 10:12 AM
Hiya Peterk,

I have a EVO70 and 62. Luv 'em. I'm a bit lighter then you and tend to get thrown around in really rough stuff, such as B'n'J, conditions when I find it a bit hard to keep the board on the water and maintain direction in a stright line. As I'm not too speed orientated and I tend to like to wave ride and jump its not too much of a problem for me anyway. Plus I use the 62 whenever possible (18 knots +).

My Kombat on the other hand, gives a nice a smooth ride no matter what. Good for dodgy knees....

SIN909
19th October 2006, 04:29 PM
Hey PeterK,

A couple of months ago I bought an 04 evo92. I wanted a board for wavesailing in really light winds for down the line, small and big waves, and the deal my local shop was offering was hard to resist. While this wasn't exactly the optimum use of the board, it works well enough. The wind I can now go out in and wavesail, is like a whole new dimension of sailing, and I get a lot more sailing days. I use a 6.1 on it, but the 22cm fin it came with was a bit small for this setup, with my weight of 178lb so I put on a 24cm. Perhaps at your weight with a 22cm might work. Anyhow, bottom turning such a big setup even in overhead waves wasn't too bad at all, so probably more so in 3/4 foot swell. But if you want a board for 4.0-5.7 conditions at your weight maybe the next size down (80litre + ?) would be something to think about for your needs. I haven't tried it in mush but I bet it would work too.

Alan
20th October 2006, 02:36 PM
I use an evo 70 for bump and jump in the short period wind swell we get on the north coast of Tasmania and I think it works best with the absolute max sail area you can hold down on the day. Sure some of the jumps are a bit random but its loads of fun. The big upside is this boards ability to make random landings easy.

Gybing in these sorts of confused conditions is also loads of fun, the board carries so much speed through the turn and for a 70 l board there is so much deck space, room enough for some John Travolta styling, purposeful or otherwise.

Sure a 52cm wide trad would give a smoother ride but where is the fun in that.

PG
21st October 2006, 02:01 AM
Peterk,
People tend to recommend pure waveboards because those are hip. But from a pragmatic point of view you should really pick the Kombat 79. It offes you the maximum versatility. It is better than a waveboard for bump and jump, and it has the speed and upwind capability to punch out in onshore conditions.
You should pick the Evo only in case you plan to major on frontside wavesailing (which is quite demanding in onshore conditions...).
Some manufacturers, like Exocet, actually sell boards that look very much like the Kombat as "pure wave" (their Exo Wave). It just illustrates that a waveboard does not need to be shaped like a banana :-)

steveC
21st October 2006, 07:04 AM
PG reiterates an interesting argument thinking about a flatter rockerline in boards like the Kombat and the Exocet Exo Wave, as Ola H. so aptly pointed out much earlier in his comments above. I suggested consideration of the PA line earlier, because I'm one of those folks that use and prefer a straighter and faster tail rocker. After being a surfer for over 23 years before discovering windsurfing, I can easily make a flatter rocker work for me, except in the most radical off the lip maneuvers where all that extra wavey rocker stands out. In reality, a reasonably loose rocker that has some speed and projection better suits my goals.

I remember in my first trip to Maui in 1991, I rented a custom Naish waveboard that was so rockered that it wasn't very much fun out and about. I couldn't return it quick enough and get something else. The epoxy 8'6" Copello Redline board a exchanged it for was much more satisfying.

No doubt, the choices really say much about your real focus and what's fun in your mind. No hard criticisms either way.

GEM
21st October 2006, 11:05 AM
In not dissimilar conditions but on fresh water, I must say I was encouraged by Jim Karabasz of Extreme Windsurfing to go with a Kombat rather than an Evo and I am VERY happy with the Kombat (I suspect I'd also be happy with an Evo). The Kombat is a very nice all around; I'm just a neophyte in maximizing waves, but the Kombat is very easy, very turny, and an OK jumper.

I always seem to pick one size larger than Ola. I would recommend the K8x size; you'll be challenged to say the least in pure 4.0 conditions, maybe even blown off the water. But given that 1) your next step up is to 145, and 2) 5.7 wind is MUCH more likely than 4.0 wind, I think you'll ride an 87L board a heck of a lot more often than you'll get to ride a 79L board. How much does it work out to be in "dollars per ride"?

Ola_H
21st October 2006, 10:31 PM
I have the K87 in my quiver and its s super nice board and I don't hesitate to call it a real wave board (practically the same rocker as the Acids actually). I?m somthing like 15lbs myself and can comfortable use it with a 6.3 (and probably bigger with some coaxing). I haven't used it with smaller than 4.5, but I gather its possible to use ot with a 4.0 too, so it could be an option. On the other hand I think these kinds of boards sail rather big for their size and epsecially handle big sails and light wind very well. Since you (peterk) is also explicitly willing to sacrifice light wind performance, the K79 seems like the logical choice and I still regard it as big enough (especially dynamically, ie when you are moving).

As for the Starsurfer, I've used both that board and the Aero (07) which is the exact same shape. The Starsurfer is a super nice beginners board but the extra weight compared to the Aero does detract a bit from especially the light wind fun. So, as others pointed out, there will be a bit of a gap in your quiver when youhave no ideal board, since you don't emphasize perfect performance in these conditions I don't see this as a "catastrophic" thing. GEMs argument (regarding K87) is valid to to and will give you less of a gap at the expense of comfort in the high wind range. I don't think the time on water and early planing with a 5.7 will differ much at your weight when comparing K79 and 87 though. The better technique you have, the less the difference will be. The 87 will mainly give you more options if you want to use the board with even bigger sails.

Cheers,