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30th April 2008 09:59 PM
Unregistered
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
The irony is that most Mal riders don't give a rat's about sitting wide and being wave hogs when there are short boarders in the line-up. It's about time they got some of their own medicine.
Tsk, Tsk, poor little cry-baby whinging about "Mal riders." What's the matter, someone took away your rattle? Get a life, and a big L on your forehead, and leave this discussion to the adults, until you're grown up, ok?
30th April 2008 01:11 PM
Unregistered Yeah, it's a little bit of "what goes around comes around". From what I have witnessed, I would suggest that the group of surfers most disdvantaged by SUPs, and whinging the loudest about them, are Mal riders. Why...

1. *Majority* of SUP riders are going to go for the same sort of waves that most Mal riders prefer - smaller, softer, slower, not bigger, faster, steeper barrels.

2. Most Mal riders under 60 are doing it 'cause they are too unfit, and too lazy to get fit, to surf a short board. Instead, they can rely on the Mal's paddle speed to make up for it.

3. Most guys doing SUP in the surf are fit, and can surf short boards well, and use their SUP when it's too small for a short board. If they are not fit and can't surf, they aren't going to be able to SUP. The exact opposite of most Mal riders.

The irony is that most Mal riders don't give a rat's about sitting wide and being wave hogs when there are short boarders in the line-up. It's about time they got some of their own medicine.
28th April 2008 12:58 AM
Unregistered
Quote:
Originally Posted by steveC View Post
With the introduction and growth of SUP activities in the waves, it's just a matter of time before things get real messy. With windsurfing and kiting, the presence of wind kind of works naturally to separate the situation at bit from the surfing scene. Surfers normally get the morning and late afternoon glass off to get their fix, so the peace is generally easier to maintain.

But with the SUP thing, they're jumping right into the middle of the surfer's primetime game. The surfer that started this thread is absolutely right about the need for reasonable fairness and balance. From what I've noticed, often the SUP surfers will pick spots that better correspond with their style of wave riding, and that's a good thing overall. This approach to things makes good sense, as it allows things work with much less potential conflict.

However, at the better spots (faster, more critical breaks) where significant crowds of surfers congregate, I think that SUP surfers need to be especially cautious and thoughtful if they want to fit in. It doesn't take too many SUPs to effectively dominate a lineup and sow the seeds of deep discontent. Surfers are quite a steely and determined group that doesn't always hold back their emotions and actions. Believe me, I know the scene quite well having been a dedicated surfer for over 23 years before starting windsurfing in the mid 80s.

There's always a sensitive balance in the lineup that needs to be maintained to preclude trouble. As long as the SUP folks understand that, then a relative peace can be maintained.
Hey SteveC, you are right on the money with these observations. We actually agree on something!

Aloha
27th April 2008 12:24 PM
Unregistered
Can they coexist?

Hell....with all the fighting going on amongst kitesurfers, surfers, windsurfers....now....SUP-ers?

Let the games begin!!!!!!!!!!
27th April 2008 11:29 AM
James As a windsurfer, the whole territorial, pecking-order aspect of surfing seems very alien and unappealing to me. I just thank goodness I never have to deal with that bullshit.
27th April 2008 01:20 AM
steveC With the introduction and growth of SUP activities in the waves, it's just a matter of time before things get real messy. With windsurfing and kiting, the presence of wind kind of works naturally to separate the situation at bit from the surfing scene. Surfers normally get the morning and late afternoon glass off to get their fix, so the peace is generally easier to maintain.

But with the SUP thing, they're jumping right into the middle of the surfer's primetime game. The surfer that started this thread is absolutely right about the need for reasonable fairness and balance. From what I've noticed, often the SUP surfers will pick spots that better correspond with their style of wave riding, and that's a good thing overall. This approach to things makes good sense, as it allows things work with much less potential conflict.

However, at the better spots (faster, more critical breaks) where significant crowds of surfers congregate, I think that SUP surfers need to be especially cautious and thoughtful if they want to fit in. It doesn't take too many SUPs to effectively dominate a lineup and sow the seeds of deep discontent. Surfers are quite a steely and determined group that doesn't always hold back their emotions and actions. Believe me, I know the scene quite well having been a dedicated surfer for over 23 years before starting windsurfing in the mid 80s.

There's always a sensitive balance in the lineup that needs to be maintained to preclude trouble. As long as the SUP folks understand that, then a relative peace can be maintained.
26th April 2008 11:40 PM
Unregistered
No, you're a hairy ass.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NAASUP View Post
Yet another disenfranchised group of yahoos fighting for access! Who's next? Geriatric paddleboat geezers?

Thank god I'm a kiter so I can launch phat air all over you!!!
What's hilarious, AASFUC, is that you and your kiting buddies have been essentially banned from the entire North Shore, and have been relegated to a little shit beach down by the sewage plant. Joke's on you, pal.
26th April 2008 10:48 PM
NAASUP
This is hilariass!!!

Yet another disenfranchised group of yahoos fighting for access! Who's next? Geriatric paddleboat geezers?

Thank god I'm a kiter so I can launch phat air all over you!!!
26th April 2008 02:52 PM
Ola_H I don't know if there is some official Starboard policy, but when I personally SUP, I usually give regular surfers priority, maybe not every single time but I leave a reasonable amount of waves. Since SUPs are usually big and heavy, I also try to avoid catching waves directly outside of the shortboard lineup so that I don't send my board on them should I crash. I think this is sensible behavior. This means I may move to a different section of the wave if shortboarders come out and place themselves directly inside me.

But at some places, it seems it i more like the "law of the jungle". When shortboarders and longboardsers are everywhere with no structure to it, drop on on each other, paddle out everywhere etc and when it is pretty much already a mess, then there is not much to do about it as a SUPer except just ad a bit more to the mess.

As I see it, SUP is a part of surfing. I think the established rules and guidelines of surfing should apply. At least in my world, this includes the people wih bigger gear someimes leave a wave for someone on smaller gear that may catch the wave further inside but still be closer to the critical section. The problem with surfing sometimes, is that it is so elitist and competitive. That kind of attitude does not promote a healthy dialogue so for a beginner, it is hard to get a feeling for these kinds of agreements. A beginner doing something wrong more often get told to get the hell out of there (regardless if SUPing or surfing) than he gets an explanation of the "dynamics" of how a lineup should work.

At places where there is already a more positive attitude surrounding the lineup, I'm willing to bet the the introduction of SUPers will be much less of a problem.
26th April 2008 02:01 PM
Fed Up Surfer
SUPs and Surfers - can they coexist?

When windsurfers share the break with surfers, the surfers have the priority, on every wave. This is considered reasonable by all parties concerned because of the windsurfers' advantages in speed and mobility.

When SUPs get into the break, the situation is chaos. SUPs can catch a wave very early compared to surfers, much like a windsurfer. Yet the SUPs are not subject to any of the same rules.

I have personally witnessed - and also, I'll admit, been party to - altercations between SUPs and surfers where the SUPs were simply being wave hogs and taking every wave, not leaving any breathing room for the surfers. I have seen SUPs aggressively threatening surfers with their sharp-tipped paddles and intimidating them off the waves. Not cool.

At some breaks the SUPs are simply not allowed by the local surfers - not unless they are Laird Hamilton or the like. But at other breaks, where a strong local presence is lacking, the SUPs have become a nuisance.

The situation is such that soon some surfers may soon go to their County Council member and ask for an ordinance banning SUPs from the vicinity of surfers - much like the infamous ten-man rule at Ho'okipa - this is being discussed.

SUPs had better self-regulate, or they will be forcibly regulated - that is inevitable.

Starboard is one of the leading promoters of the SUP sport - does Starboard promote responsible behavior, or is it content to cash in and let the breaks turn into a battlefield? Let's see some leadership coming from those who profit from the sport.

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