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-   -   Phantom 301 cm or Start M? (http://www.star-board-windsurfing.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2054)

ama 12th June 2007 07:40 PM

Phantom 301 cm or Start M?
 
Hi

Kids from 11 to 19,is going to learn windsurfing. No experience.

Should i go for an Start M, or Phantom 301.

I like the with of the Start's M 90 cm Phantom 80

I have seen experienced local club members do quite well on Starts in strong wind with 5.5 sails, could we do that with Phantom too, or it is more like the old ones.

I have doubt here at what i should go for of these two. Was keen on getting a Start M, as our family board, but get an advice about the Phantom too?

Anybody shed some light on these.

ama

Roger 13th June 2007 11:54 AM

RE: Phantom 301 cm or Start M?
 
Hello Ama,
The Start (especially the older Starts) are the best boards for absolute beginners.
Whether to get the Start L or the Start M will depend on the weight of your kids.
Once they've sailed the Start and have their basic skills( uphauling, getting the basic position "T" alignment, stepping back to get both feet behind the mast foot, balancing the rig over the mast foot, and rotating the shoulders (from the hips) to power up the sail, basic tacks and flare or rope jibes) the Phantom 301 will be fine.
Since they are kids, they will figure things out pretty quickly, and they might do all right on the Phantom, right from the start, but it would be better to have someone else in your club (perhaps someone who has a Start or can use the club's Starts) teach them the basics and then they will be ready for the Phantom 301.
Oh, and a 5.5 m2 rig is far too big for beginners. Might not be too big for you larger children, but for sure too heavy.
I use the Phantom 301 with a 4.2 or 5.0 m2 Sailworks Retor Ripper 3 as my "tether board" in our "A Taste of Windsurfing" Program,and I put the students on either a Rio M (little folks heavier than 80 lbs.) or a 2001/2002 Start for the heavier students. The little one's use a 2.5 m2 Retro Ripper 3 and the larger kids get a 3.3 or 4.2 m2 Ripper 3 depending on the wind conditions.
For smaller kids, I ride on the front of the Start with them as I don't think it's a good idea to send peoples small children out on a board all by themselves. They can have problems and get so frustrated they "give up" on windsurfing. If they can handle it well, they get a board with a small sail on the tether, right away, but they have to show me they can uphaul and master the other basic skills first.
Hope this helps,

ama 13th June 2007 01:52 PM

RE: Phantom 301 cm or Start M?
 
Hi

Yeah, well, i am not talking about letting them out alone etc, and the sail is 2.5 kvm. The 5.5 was to illustrate that he sailed the Start in strong vind, and he had a lot of fun on it.
What i was unsure about, was the progressing state from Start M to Phantom.

Start M would be fine, as the kids are not so heavy.
How is the handling of the longer Phantom against the shorter Start?

/ama

Roger 13th June 2007 10:17 PM

RE: Phantom 301 cm or Start M?
 
Hi ama,
The handling is similar.
The Start handles/responds more like the wide board that it is, and with a big rig it may plane a little earlier than the Phantom, but you will need to pump it over it's bow wave.
The Phanotm handles a bit more like an older longboard, and it glides far better in underpowered conditions.
It also just "transitions" from subplaning and onto a plane quite easily without the need for a really large rig.
As far as handling for beginners you may have a little problem with a rig as small as 2.5 m2.
Be sure to put the mast foot as far back (closer to the centerboard's resistance) as possible as these tiny rigs have the CE (power point) very near the mast so it's often difficult to get the power back far enough over the CLR (the resistance of the centerboard when fully down and deployed).
If you can't get the CE of the little rig far enough back, the board will have downwind tendancies due to the CE being too far forward of the CLR.
Hope this helps,


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