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Old 15th March 2008, 02:40 AM   #31
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Instead of changing the subject (again!), why not address some of the points that were raised in response to your previous posts?

Bottom line - it is always good to hear all sides of an issue. But your mindless regurgitation of the idea that an illegal business should be allowed to destroy a local community despite countless well-informed rebuttals has become really irritating.

We get it - YOU (who haven't been here since 1997 and have no clue as to the actual situation, or the demographic make up of those who wish to leave current zoning ordinances which prohibit TVRs unchanged) - are going to make an extra special effort to also not visit THIS year because you take exception to the idea that ohana, kokua and aloha are important to the people that live here.

I'm guessing Maui will manage to survive your boycott, as would this forum should you decide to take things to the next level.
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Old 15th March 2008, 06:14 AM   #32
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Thumbs down hey whats up with adult debate???

steve c i agree , and not just because i think VR whould not have been delt so heavily handed .But there is merit for doing what maui country did
But to the point of my comment, one: I think IMHO most of the "opinions" from these anon folks are just one "folk". I beleive the same "individuals" well thought out arguments can be found on old archived blog comments over at giampaolos maui-windsurf report website. The way this person uses language fits the bill.

Two: I cannot understand the mindset of a person whos well though logical reasoning slowly degrades into insults.
Unregistered, your arguments are very valid and well thought out and make sense , but why then taint them with high browed insults???
Because you disagree???
such actions just degrade the same points you have taken so much time to develope.
Even after these actions , I respect your opinions but further attacks will lead to a loss of respect for you.

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Old 15th March 2008, 07:53 AM   #33
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Default Sorry!


If you read my earlier posts (7,12,13) I really WAS trying to have an intelligent conversation with SteveC before I allowed my frustration to get the better of me. My bad for calling him a troll, though.

I have never posted on the Maui-Windsurf Report website, but I do know that there are quite a few people within the Maui windsurf community who share my view that the county is doing the right thing. The idea that there is a lone troll promoting an anti-TVR agenda by posting on ALL the forums, writing ALL the letters to the editor etc has been flogged to death by the TVR camp.

The truth is that there are three well-reasoned dissenting voices in this thread alone on an obscure windsurfing forum. That should tell you something.
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Old 15th March 2008, 07:59 AM   #34
Da Kine Braddah
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You guys have to understand, not all locals are against the TVR. You happen to have one guy here in this forum. I would be willing to bet he isnt even born and raised on Maui. Anyways, doesnt matter. The fact is many of us support the existance of TVrs. I am in no way involved in the business but when family come to Maui, they need cheap place to stay and I cant put everyone in my place, so, the TVRs are convenient.

Many of who voted for Charmain are sorry we did so. She is not really acting with Aloha but with heavy hand. The TVR industry is an important part of the economy and with properly regulation will continue to be so. Most of us agree that instead of the heavy handed approach the mayor is taking she should have gone the route of going after the problem business that had complaints, and actively going after them. Some neighborhoods actually like have the TVRs. I know my street in Haiku used to have this place down the way that was boarded up and attracted the kids and druggies. Someone bought the place, cleaned it up nice and we never have trouble ever again. No more break ins. Good for everyone on our street.

As much as "unregistered" has an ax to grind, luckily he is in the minority. Recently the county council has gotten to the table with real solutions to the mess and are proposing changes that would allow for most of these business to open up again. There are goign to be some changes, but for the most part, all will be good to go. The changes they are proposing make sense for the long term. Going forward only the problem TVRs are going to be shutdown.

Also, 'unregistered' may not know it or not, but most of the TVRs were compliant with the state tax law and were already paying the hotel rate. Thats why you havent heard about any massive tax crack down in the mix with the county actions. The 'illegal' TVRs have been looking for regular and steamlined process for many many years. Its finally coming. Unfortunately, it may be too little too late for many families here who lived on Maui for generations if not foreva, and used TVR to keep affording to live in da place of their birth, but now are in foreclosure. Very sad day for many families here. Many people think this is all about the rich haloe coming to Maui. The majority of these places are home grown local style. Anyways. Resolution coming soon.

Peace and aloha....

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Old 15th March 2008, 09:45 AM   #35
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Hey Dakine

My family used to stay in TVRs too. Now they stay somewhere else. Life goes on.

Think about this:

That house in Haiku could have been bought by the children of a third or fourth generation family and fixed up just as nicely. If they didn't have to compete with TVR 'investors', they could have got it cheap, too.

The third and fourth generation families bought their houses long before the real estate bubble - the houses are going into foreclosure are the ones that traded in the past few years when families had no choice but to pay inflated prices. Those prices were fueled by low interest rates and TVRs creating a huge demand in a market with limited supply.

Finally, I don't have an axe to grind - if anything, I lose when TVRs are shut down, because the market value of MY house goes down. But I think I will win in another area - I think the north shore will be a nicer place to live for my keiki if the people born and raised here with normal jobs can afford to buy a house and continue to live here.

I think that is far truer to the spirit of aloha than the short term gain of a few at the expense of many.
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Old 15th March 2008, 07:40 PM   #36
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Default the long term real changes

Not to sound like the chiding mother but thats more like it.
I too hope their is a golden middle somewhere.
i think in 50 years maui will be more laid back then some think. And it all comes down to fossil fuels.
the writing is on the wall.
While air travel is still cheap , it will not be like this forever. The economic changes that more expensive oil will bring is such that less people will travel to maui as they simply will not be able to afford the airfare.
sound dumb?? well i dont think so.
Now one might think that the rich will still be able to go to maui. Maybe the very rich , but while everyday their are more people in the world there are less rich people and anyways the baja is closer.
it also will be more expenisive to live in maui, and if one is reliant on things shipping in from off island.
then the people of maui will have real challenges, plantations all over again and maybe real food crops will be grown.
perhaps poi back in style as a staple not a luau curiosity.

humans have a short memory. and we are lucky we live in the time that we do.
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