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Old 13th June 2011, 09:07 PM   #11
COACHG
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Sounds like you need lessons or more TOW. I'm only a couple of Kg/s lighter then you and have sailed the Rocket 145. With the 8.5 & upper 40 to low 50 cm fin you should be planing and reaching speeds in the mid 20's mph when small ripples occur on the water with no white caps. When white caps occur with small ripples you should be able to use the 7.5 with mid to upper 40 cm fin and reach speeds in the upper 20's. When small chop occurs you should be able to use your 6.6 with a mid to low 40 cm fin and easily hit speeds in the low 30's. I would not use that board with a 6.0 as the board feels too large with that sail for me.

The above numbers are for BAF sailing not going real deep off the wind. I don't list wind speeds because it seems that those very from place to place. In other words 20 knts where I sail looks a whole lot different then 20 knts where other people sail.

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Old 13th June 2011, 10:03 PM   #12
Ken
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ittiandro,

You have the right gear for your level of development. We all encounter points where we get frustrated with the next level of advancement, but persistence will soon move you to the next level. The Rio is a great beginning board on which you can learn all the basics, (upwind, downwind, up-hauling, tacking, jibing, planing, beach starts, water starts, footstraps, harness usage, etc.). The Tabau is an excellent second step in your progression. Assuming you still have the Rio, don't be afraid to work on all the above when you have the volume and dagger board to make it all pretty easy.

At your weight (80kg), the Tabau should be easy to up-haul with a little practice. To plane on it with your 8.5, it will take about 13 knots without pumping (11 knots with pumping). With the 7.5, add two knots. As your skills improve, you can subtract a little from the above numbers.

Stick with it and you will soon see that it is all worth while. Don't bother with the Tabau unless you see light to moderate white caps or you will just be slogging along. By the way, learning to tack and jibe, while keeping upwind on a slogging board with no daggerboard is GOOD practice. Don't rush it, It just takes time for your body's balance to adapt to the various moves necessary to windsurf.

The 7.5 and 8.5 sails are large for a beginner/novice sailor where a 6.5 or 5.5 would be easier. Those that learn on the smaller sails progress quickly to the larger sails because they want to plane. Planing on a 5 or 6 meter sail takes quite a bit of wind. This is probably where your frustration come in, but things will be better soon.
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Old 14th June 2011, 06:55 AM   #13
ittiandro
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Thank you Ken, Coachg, Windman, Joe Windsurfer, Nakaniko and others for your 2nd round of valuable comments, replies and suggestions. I’ll definitely look into the Starboard Serenity, as suggested by Nakaniko, But, oh boy ! at 257 lts volume the Serenity must be a yacht! . Deve essere una nave scuola ! Nakaniko, vedo che sei di Venezia. Salutami la Serenissima. Sono un suo antico suddito ( Bergamasco), che vive in Canadà. Il glorioso Leone di San Marco campeggia dovunque nella mia città e sono cresciuto alla sua ombra.! Peccato che quel fetente di Napoleone abbia dissolto la Repubblica di Venezia ( per poi passarla agli austriaci) . Ma pazienza, la storia non si può disfarla ! We can't undo history .
May everybody enjoy this fantastic sport and good wind to you all, wherever you are !

Ittiandro
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Old 14th June 2011, 04:22 PM   #14
nakaniko
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Pai attention Ittiandro, I told you what is MY solution, but also that I hope that Roger or someone else could judge the best board for your level. This is what Ken have just done. Serenity is a fantastic idea for people who don't have problems of storing and carying such a big gondola, but is NOT a beginner board, and requires the same or even more balance that your Tabou, as it has a round hull and is only 61,5 cm in the middle. 257 litres gives perfect longitudinal balance, but not lateral, where board requires quick tacks and balanced jibes like on my 110 litres freestyle. Yes if winds in your spot are 70-80% lower than 10 knots, there's no board in the world that can give what Serenity gives, but if you can loose some speed in the lower winds for having a fully planing board, Phantom 320 could be a great solution fore having both opportunities, even if also the Phanton is not really a beginner board; but do you still have the Rio with you or not?
I think that if a lot of people would be given the opportunity to try the serenity AFTER LEARNING, we vould have in the future a lot of cruising windsurfs on the beaches like was on the 80's. But I don't want you to make a "blind jump"before you have the proper skill. At least find a place wher to try the Serenity before, and so with the more common Phantom 320.
Grazie per le parole su Venezia e la Serenissima, con anche una morosa di nome Serena non è un caso che mi sono preso il Serenity
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Old 14th June 2011, 09:13 PM   #15
Ken
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Nakaniko is right on with the Serenity. IT'S NOT a beginner or novice board. Possibly an intermediate, but very tricky to sail, tack and jibe. Incredibly efficient in light winds, but nothing more.

I also thought about the Phantom 320, but it is a race board that can do everything, but nothing really well. The Rio is just as good or better in light winds (sub-planing) and the Tabau is probably equal to or better at planing speeds.

Ittiandro - you have what you need. Now get on the water and practice. To learn fast, never sail on a reach for more than 20-30 seconds without a tack or jibe. The sooner you do 100 of each, the faster you master the skills. Most beginners sail on a reach until they get uncomfortable with the distance from shore and then tack back to shore. In a couple of hours, they may get in 10-15 tacks and that's it. Don't waste your time on long reaches. There will be plenty of time for that when your skills improve.

Another way to continue progressing fast is to set a goal of 10 successful tacks and 10 jibes before you allow yourself to head out on some longer reaches. Do them as fast as possible, with only a few seconds between them. Windsurfing is like snow skiing - it's all about TURNING.
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Old 15th June 2011, 11:25 PM   #16
nakaniko
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Thanks Ken. I do not completely agree that windsurfing is about turning like snow skking (but I snowboard). Eceplt from waveriding, usually windsurf is about flying over the water, not turning every time, pherephs as I think at the sport. Sure for beginners turning frequently gives a big help in learning, I agree.
even for serenity I think that the board is not a beginner board, but on the opposite, at least in the flat water of my Venice Lagoon, I don't find it absolutely tricky to turn, not so difficult to tack if your balanced and quick, a little more difficult to jibe, but far from being impossible
This to clear offf some opinions I've readin many places, that can show to riders a beautiful but almost impossible board (for intermediate and advanced). It's imho and enjoyable board!
Ps: why you keep in calling the board of Ittiandro Tabau and not Tabou? To avoid some family filter on tabou word?
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Old 16th June 2011, 03:25 AM   #17
Ken
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Learning to sail straight away (reach) is pretty easy for beginners on the newer wider beginner boards. Tacking and then jibing become the next challenge. Most intermediate sailors are pretty inconsistent with their jibes and sometimes tacks. It's a problem that I think many windsurfers are slow to solve, thus my recommendation to do a lot of tacks and jibes.

Snowboarders don't do much turning, just straight down with some occasional sliding (over stated, but you get my point). Few snowboarders can do nice carving turns on an edge. On the other hand, most skiers do a lot of turning, but novice skiers on moderate slopes generally won't turn until they have to. Either turn or run into the trees. The more turns you do, the quicker you progress. In windsurfing, it's possible to sail for hours and only make a few turns. Not good for learning if you are a novice.

Tabou is correct. Sorry, just started with Tabau and keep repeating it.
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Old 16th June 2011, 04:04 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken View Post
Learning to sail straight away (reach) is pretty easy for beginners on the newer wider beginner boards. Tacking and then jibing become the next challenge. Most intermediate sailors are pretty inconsistent with their jibes and sometimes tacks. It's a problem that I think many windsurfers are slow to solve, thus my recommendation to do a lot of tacks and jibes.
You're right, I'm an example of it
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken View Post
Snowboarders don't do much turning, just straight down with some occasional sliding (over stated, but you get my point). Few snowboarders can do nice carving turns on an edge. .
Aaaargh, you are telling the truth! I'm an expert snowboarder, a freecarving lover, hate freestyle, love too much powder. Involved now in learning www.extremecarving.com. But 90% of snowboarders after first hour wants to jump and then in the tracks their riding is simply UGLY. Ops is out of topic here...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken View Post
In windsurfing, it's possible to sail for hours and only make a few turns. Not good for learning if you are a novice.
Now I'll keep in mind to avoid this, hoping to finally reach a fully planing jibe

Last edited by nakaniko; 16th June 2011 at 04:06 AM.
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