Phantom 377 -- Please don't do it!

[Bananentiger]

Am a bit more heavy than you.
But I have been using the last 2 years a Mega Cat with 250 ltr and had always diffculties to rail and achieve a constant speed and flow of the board.
With the F2 it is much easier for me to rail and to achieve a constant speed.
Therefore I like the bigger volume and shpae of my F2.

I think I need to test the new board to be able to compare.

[CAN 32]

If you compare the stats for the Equipe II and the new Phantom 377, there is not a significant difference, with the exception of the wingers on the tail (which were an old [unsuccessful] design used back in the '80's on such boards as the Mistral Pandera). Why would anyone want to buy the new Phantom 377, when it has basically the same size, shape and volume of an already existing longboard that is available in most countries at a quarter of the price? In Canada an Equipe II sells for between $500 to $800 depending on condition. A new Phantom 380 retails for $3100 + taxes. While it's really nice to see longboards being produced once again I really worry that the current manufacturers haven't learned from the mistakes of the past when in the 1980's and '90's the manufacturers nearly killed longboard racing by pricing them out of reach of many consumers (my first Equipe II in 1994 cost me about the same as my new Phantom 380 just did last week!). Starboard has an excellent and successful design in the Phantom 380 so don't jeopardise the small (fledgling) market by making too many changes too quickly while jacking up the price at the same time. If it ain't broke... don't fix it!!!

[Remi]

Hi Bananentiger

The Phantom Race 377 is 67cm wide with 78cm dagger board + the mast track who is 3 cm higher than the deck for up wind, all together this help a lot to get very quickly on the rail despit 263 litters. Hope this help to understand the concept.
Anyway the best is to try
All the best

[Can 102]

Another typical race night here in Canada -- four races in 5-12 knots. No planing for anyone. How is a 268 litre board going to keep up with a 305 (or more with the new Exocet) litre board?

[CAN 32]

Probably best to stick to the 15-20 yr. old Equipe II's, Cats or Lightnings since they are about the same size as the new Phantom 377 and besides they are a lot more durable. I was hit by a 29er that was under a full plane with the chute up, a couple of years ago while racing on my Equipe II at CORK. There was no damage to the Equipe (it just bounced off the 29er) but there was a big scrape up the side of the 29er. I seriously doubt that my new Phantom would survive that sort of impact.

[bushfire.one]

Sounds like there will be no Phantom 377s sold in Canada!!
I'll post my opinions as soon as I get my hands on one - probably December

I must admit that volume isn't everything. I was (at 90kg) quite competitive on my 250 litre Fanatic Mega Cat in the light winds - even against sailors on the Phantom 380. Technique & sail selection/tuning have a large part to play in performance.

Board fragility is definitely an issue. Any racing board made of carbon tends to be fragile and needs to be handled very carefully. The old boards were certainly very hardy - most of the boards in our fleet are still going strong 20 years+ down the track. The most recent of the old boards (e.g. AHD & F2 380) are quite fragile - not many of these left in my area.

How many raceboards are you getting to your races? Our season starts in a week's time - can't wait.

[Remi]

Hi Can 102

5/12 knots you can be sure with the Phantom Race 377 will plane in this condition, now for the septic the best way it's to try and Can 32 funny to compare this board to the Pandera but their is absolute not possible to compare this boards
Have fun in this fantastic class

All the best

[CAN 32]

Originally Posted by bushfire.one

Sounds like there will be no Phantom 377s sold in Canada!!
I'll post my opinions as soon as I get my hands on one - probably December

I must admit that volume isn't everything. I was (at 90kg) quite competitive on my 250 litre Fanatic Mega Cat in the light winds - even against sailors on the Phantom 380. Technique & sail selection/tuning have a large part to play in performance.

Board fragility is definitely an issue. Any racing board made of carbon tends to be fragile and needs to be handled very carefully. The old boards were certainly very hardy - most of the boards in our fleet are still going strong 20 years+ down the track. The most recent of the old boards (e.g. AHD & F2 380) are quite fragile - not many of these left in my area.

How many raceboards are you getting to your races? Our season starts in a week's time - can't wait.

At my Club, we are getting up to 25 to 30 longboards out to our weekly races depending on wind conditions - less so on really light days. Most boards are 1980's and 1990's vintage raceboards but there is a growing fleet of Phantom 380's which (in it's current form) we find to be very competitive against the older boards. In winds above 15kts the Phantom has a distinct edge especially if the racer is using the 9.5 Severne Raceboard sail. We have 10 Phantom 380's in the Club right now and after the results they have produced this season there is a lot of interest from others in this board.

Our season ends at the end of September, but so far we've logged 50 races since the beginning of May. Hopefully it'll be windy until the end of Sept.

For me the Phantom is great since I am over 180 pounds and the board planes that much earlier than my Equipe II does. I'm very impressed with the 2011 Phantom 380 and see the impending changes for 2012 to be more of a step backwards rather than an innovation.

[CAN 32]

Originally Posted by Remi

Hi Can 102

5/12 knots you can be sure with the Phantom Race 377 will plane in this condition, now for the septic the best way it's to try and Can 32 funny to compare this board to the Pandera but their is absolute not possible to compare this boards
Have fun in this fantastic class

All the best

Remi, you're right - there's no comparison between the Phantom 380 and the Pandera, since the Pandera was a lot smaller and considered to be a 'funboard'. My point was that Mistral put wingers on the Pandera in an attempt to improve it's performance, an experiment that ultimately failed. I see Starboard's choice to put wingers on the Phantom in the same light as what Mistral did and I don't think that there will be any significant changes in performance in the Phantom 377, compared to the 380 especially considering all of the other changes you are making as well. To me I see wingers on the Phantom as simply a gimmick which will probably disappear in a year or two when they prove to be useless. Starboard needs to stick with a concept that works (the Phantom 380 in it's current form - 2011 version) and work on tweaking it's details like making sure all it's components work (or are assembled) properly when the boards leave the factory.

Look at the legacy of the Equipes, Cats and Lightnings... people are choosing to sail these for a reason and very minor modifications to the shape were made during the time these boards were being manufactured (the only significant changes were in volume). Wouldn't it be nice if 20 years from now people are saying the same thing about the current Phantom 380??

[Remi]

Hi Can 32
I think the better for you it's to try it and you will see by yourself also it's definitely look like not at any wingers have been done until now. Just for fun I call them "Bat wings", they start from the mast track until the tail. So the board have a very limited drags in non planning condition and this "Bat Wings" help also a lot to get planning because the weight surface is wider than any Race-Board on the market.
Anyway have fun in this class who is my favorite class also

All the best