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Old 26th April 2007, 08:14 AM   #1
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Default Serenity

Hi Roger
I just stumbled upon this Serenity board and it looks amazing in Video.
It is so gracefull. I am looking for a board that will plane under 10 knots or at least feel good and fast, it seems Serenity is it?
I weigh 130 pounds (before breakfast) and do have a 10 M sail.
I windsurf OK. Do you think that is a good choice?
And how is it better than Formula wide boards? And how does it compare to Kona?
Thanks a lot

Alena
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Old 26th April 2007, 09:15 AM   #2
Roger
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Default RE: Serenity

Hi Alena,
Yes, the Serenity is a very amazing concept!
It's both fast in light winds and very graceful, slicing over the water and through the chop like a scalpel.
The Serenity does not really "plane" (although I suspect that depends on how you define "planing" ) but the bow wave does move back when you get it going.
Your 10 m2 sail would not be needed on the Serenity, but you can certainly use a sail that large.
The Serenity "glides" over the water so easily, it does not really need a large rig.
7.5-8.5 is as big as I would ever consider, but I've sailed the Serenity with 9.0 m2.
Problem is the larger rigs are a bit more difficult to balance, and the
Serenity is a bit challenging to balance on in the transitions.
It's better than formula wide boards because it glides along in winds
(2-7 knots) that won't get the wide boards planing, even with the largest rigs.
The Kona is probably a better board for higher winds, but the Serenity sails circles around the Kona in < 6 knots.
Hope this helps,
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Old 27th April 2007, 12:31 AM   #3
James
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Default RE: Serenity

I agree with Roger. The Serenity is an amazing board. It doesn&#39;t plane, but it really feels good and fast in less than 10 knots.

I used to have a formula board. It was great in 10-15 knots, but it was frustrating if there wasn&#39;t quite enough wind to plane, because then I would be going slow while struggling to carry a big sail. The advantage of the Serenity is that it doesn&#39;t need a big sail, and you don&#39;t have to worry about "will I be able to plane?".

Now I have a Kona. It&#39;s easy to ride, and it&#39;s fun when it&#39;s on a plane. But when the winds are < 10 knots I wish I had a Serenity.
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Old 27th April 2007, 04:41 AM   #4
Jean-Marc
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Default RE: Serenity

Tested today the Serenity with NP RX2 10.6 sail in slowly increasing 4-8 knots of wind (over 1 hr) with 70 cm fin, and in slowly decreasing 8-4 knots of wind (over 1 hr) with 40 cm fin. I&#39;m 183 cm tall and weight 65 kg.

IMHO, the board does plane in the sense that when the hull just below the carry handle climbs over the bow wave, half of the hull is out and above the water surface when being overpowered in...8 knots of wind. This is starting to be a bit tipsy and scary, especially when the large 70 cm fin wants to overturn the board upside down. The shorter Shallow 41 cm fin does increase the control in overpowered mode, however.

In 4 knots of wind, it does not plane, the first 25% of the nose (around the feet of the painted Tiki on the deck) is out of water when the hull is gliding silently (with only a sssssss sound) through water. The most surprise is the silence made by the hull when sailing in such low wind, hence its aptly name Serenity.

For me, a great ride from 4 up to 8 knots. At 7-8 knots, I keep the same 10.6 sail and just switch for a planing board. Not tested yet below 4 knots of wind but I guess I would need enough low wind to still be able to steer the board. More tests later (e.g., with smaller sails and fins in higher wind).

test with 70 cm fin :
http://mytrims.com/mytrims/trim4.asp?trimID=18206
test with 41 cm fin
http://mytrims.com/mytrims/trim4.asp?trimID=18210

Cheers !

JM
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Old 27th April 2007, 07:43 AM   #5
Roger
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Default RE: Serenity

Hi JM,
I&#39;d really be interested in your "my trims data" (GPS?) with a good 60 cm race fin.
I&#39;ve found the smaller fin to be a good bit faster in very light winds with smaller sails (7.5 Severne Glide and 7.2 Sailworks NX slm), and the Serenity still goes upwind very well.
I&#39;ve found the 70 cm fin that comes with the Serenity to be a bit "cathcie" (it loads one way, goes through neutral and then "&#39;catches"very hard the other way) in transitions, and I&#39;ve not felt that I was losing much upwing angle or speed with the smaller fin.
Try a smaller rig and fin and I think you will be even more stoked on the < 12 knot performance of the Serenity.
I&#39;ve sailed it with a 5.6 m3 Sailworks Hucker and a 32 cm Lessacher Design or 32 cm Tangent Dynamics weed fin in < 4 knots and it still cruises right along.
Might try the mast foot more forward and try to keep the nose down (per Jim Drake) even when going faster as the board slips through the water better with the nose in the water.
Hope this helps,
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Old 27th April 2007, 02:13 PM   #6
Jean-Marc
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Default RE: Serenity

Hi Roger,

Yep, got the GPS onboard but batteries went dead after 2 min...next time for sure I&#39;ll get new ones.

As said, this was a short 2x1 hrs test, so still a lot more tweaking and fine-tuning to do with sails and fins like I&#39;m doing with HS105. I felt I can further extend the range of use just by switching fins and I bet a 32 cm fin would still be rideable for extra speed once overpowered in 8 knots with the 10.6 sail: large fin for low speed in low wind, small fin for high speed in higher wind.

Agree, the large 70 cm fin makes the board more slow to react during transitions than the Shallow 41 cm fin, but I&#39;ve found that when standing on the tail just behind the fin and rolling/tilting the board on the appropriate rail, tacking (tilting the leeward rail) or jibing (tilting the windward rail) can be done very quickly with a very short turning radius.

With the 10.6 sail, the mast track was set at 50% . I did notice that when feet placement were located between the carry handle and mastfoot (i.e., body weight more forward), the hull glides and slices more gently through small chop when going deep upwind. When I stood behind the carry handle (i.e., body weight more backward), the front hull kind of splash every top of chop, with greater vibrations being transmitted along the entire hull (you can actually see the nose tip shaking up and down). So, more stance tuning will be needed, I agree !

Cheers !

JM
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Old 27th April 2007, 02:56 PM   #7
Jean-Marc
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Default RE: Serenity

Alena,

You can&#39;t compare a Formula and Serenity in light wind. These are in 2 distinct leagues IMHO.

With your 58 kg and 10 m2 sail, I guess you can plane in 6-7 knots of wind with a Formula. Below that, you will be shlogging at no more than 5 knots hull speed (and it&#39;s becoming rather dull with time).

The Serenity is way faster than a Formula in shlogging mode, especially in 4-7 knots of wind, or even less (not tested yet). Nothing dull when gliding in such low wind, quite stocked in fact...! What I&#39;ve found with my 10.6 sail in 4 knots of wind is that when the Serenity starts to move forward, the pressure on the sail starts to increase as well and I do need to hook in with the harness. Kind of with increasing apparent wind speed, the Serenity accelerates and glides effortlessly over flat water at quite an impressive speed (I wouldn&#39;t be surprised to reach a hull speed at twice the true wind speed or more). I never experienced that when schlogging with a conventional board. This is unique to the Serenity so far.

In winds at and above 7 knots, I&#39;ll be curious to compare side by side the planing HS105 with the gliding Serenity. So far with the same 10.6 sail, the top range of Serenity is about 8 knots with its 70 cm fin, higher with its Shallow 41 cm fin (cannot say if board is the limiting factor as yet), but with HS105 and a 40 cm fin, 12 knots is the top range I can go, the sail and not the board being the limiting factor with my light weight. I feel I really don&#39;t need a Formula or an Apollo to fill the gap between a Serenity and a HS105 for my light weight in light wind. Both nicely complement each other.

Try a Serenity if you can in winds below 7 knots with your 10 m2 sail, I bet you&#39;ll be stocked as I&#39;m.

Cheers !

JM
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Old 28th April 2007, 05:52 AM   #8
Ian Fox
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Default RE: Serenity

Try a smaller sail, really !
It can be even more enjoyable with something easy and soft/er around 7-8m.

At first, everyone just thinks to throw more sail at it like FW and power it into performance.

STOP. right there.

This thing has a LOT more to offer than just outright "speed".

It&#39;s much more about the experience more than the performance.
(strange comment coming from me, agree, but it&#39;s true)

Cheers ~ Ian

PS : Jim officially estimated my board speed between 4 and 5kts in zero wind. That was consistant pumping (actually "fanning" in case of Serenity+7.5m Glide+70cm). Yes, there were plenty of fishing pole flags on the pure glass course to indicate "nothing". And it was dawn.



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Old 28th April 2007, 10:07 AM   #9
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Default RE: Serenity

Thanks a lot everybody.
I am looking at replacing my Mistral Malibu for low wind sailing. I have a Mistral Flow for higher winds over 15 knots.
I am definitely going to try the Serenity it is just so beautiful looking in the Videos.
The problem is that nobody is saying anything about what happens on the Serenity in winds 10-15 knots and how much fun relatively speaking does one get than? Is it still "serene"?

By the way I do not care about the actual speed I move in as long as it feels fast. I do not have a need to compete or measure the speed and could not care less. I do dislike shlogging.

Do you know at what wind speed would the Kona plane with a large sail?

I buy a new board very rarely and want to make a good choice that I will be happy with for a few years (like 15 years)
Thanks again
Alena
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Old 28th April 2007, 11:46 AM   #10
Roger
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Default RE: Serenity

Hi Alena,
I&#39;ve sailed the Serenity in a very wide range of conditions.
20-25 knots with a 4.2 m2 Sailworks Hucker (the Serenity gets "scary fast in flat water with a 32 cm Tangent Reaper weed fin in these conditions) on very flat water and it was super "exciting".
I&#39;ve sailed the Serenity in 12-16 knots with 5.6/6.6 Huckers and 7.2 m2 SW NX slm, as well as with the 7.5 m2 Severne Glide.
That&#39;s the beauty of the Serenity, you will never "slog" as long as there&#39;s at least some wind, but you can sail in all conditions up to where you want to start sailing your Flow and be "challenged" throughout the entire range.
Beyond 15 knots, you Flow may be more fun, as you can only go so fast on the Serenity, but even when it&#39;s maxed out, it&#39;s still challenging.
As I said before, I&#39;ve sailed the Kona, and if you wanted to go racing, the Kona would be a better choice as there&#39;s now a Kona class at most races in the USA.
If you just want to free sail, the Serenity is probably better as it will sail circles around the Kona in < 6-7 knots of wind.
The Kona will be in slog mode in < 6 knots, but the Serenity will go nicely, and will not require a huge sail to do it.
Hope this helps,
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