Phantom 380 vs. Competitors

Guest · 2nd April 2007, 05:24 AM

Anyone have any experiences, or educated guesses, as to how Starboard's Phantom 380 raceboard stacks up against the competition?

It looks a little more traditional than the exocet warp-x. What makes it faster than the raceboards of a few years back like the mistral superlight? Another thing is that it seems like the back of the mast track is pretty far forward - will that make it hard to use the board in fully-planing mode?

When is the first race where it will make an appearance, and will there be online coverage?

Remi · 2nd April 2007, 06:26 AM

Hi Guest,

We devellope the Phantom race 380 against the best Race-Board ever : VDB.

We make some modification on this board who increase his performance :

Plane earlier due to the 70cm wide. A lot more stable with this wide.
Get on the rail a lot quicker with the 85cm dagger board. So in realy light winds this board is really faster compare to the VDB.

In medium and high wind the Phantom Race 380 keep the legendary speed of the VDB but more easy.

So we increase in all compartment the performances of the best Race Board ever.

You have a long mast track on this board to feat all size sails 6.5 to 9.5mÂ². In the past the limit was 7.5mÂ². The back position is perfect for fully planing mode, for sure is not the same position as a iSonic

May be at the French Champioship in may, but not sure.

All the best

Randy · 2nd April 2007, 07:24 AM

What was the VDB?

Remi · 2nd April 2007, 03:28 PM

Hi Randy,

Vand Den Berg Board

All the best

Ken · 2nd April 2007, 10:19 PM

No doubt the VDB was an excellent board (I have never seen one), but my old Equipe II XR was a great board too. My largest sail at the time was a Neil Pryde light wind racer 10.6 with no twist. I wonder why the Phantom is limited to a 9.5? Was the VDB never raced in light winds (7.5 sail)?

If I ever go back to a race board again, it needs to perform in 3-10 knots with an 11.0. Any reason why the Phantom can't peform in really light winds with a big sail?

For many of us in the US, the only reason to have a race board is for light wind racing, and many of us live where the wind is pretty light most of the time.

Ken

James · 4th April 2007, 12:30 AM

Ken Wrote: "I wonder why the Phantom is limited to a 9.5?"

I don't think the board is physically limited to a 9.5, in fact it would probably do great with a 10.6 or 11.0 in light winds. ? I think *board lists 9.5 as the top of the sail range simply because that's the max size allowed in the international raceboard class.

I have a question for *board about how the phantom 380 and 320 are to be sailed. Is upwind VMG on both boards always best with the daggerboard down and mast track forward? Or is there a wind strength where you put the mast track back and sail at all headings on the fin alone, as with formula and wide hybrids? If so, about what wind strength is it for both boards?

(BTW I am the "guest" that started this thread.)

Ken · 4th April 2007, 04:39 AM

James,

Good point on the 9.5 sail size limit for the race board class.

I seriously doubt the 380 could do better upwind with the dagger board fully retracted. The 320 may be another story with the wider tail and longer (slalom?) fin.

It appears the the 380 will be better in light winds and the 320 in stronger winds. The question is - where is the break even point, where both get around the course in the same time? Somewhere around 10 to 15 knots?

Ken

James · 5th April 2007, 11:31 PM

http://stableroad.com/videos/bsy3bahamas.htm

I found this sweet video from 1987 when I was looking for pictures of the famed "VDB". It shows some very fast and fun looking longboard racing, along with slalom. Maybe daggerboards ARE cool. Van den Berg is in it, but I don't know if he's riding his most famous board or not.

Remi · 6th April 2007, 01:48 AM

Hi James and Ken,

380 vs 320 in high winds = 380 win for multiple reasons :

The 380 is in wood technologie while the 320 is in tufskin, so 380 is more light.

380 do a real good angle event in strong wind that 320 with out the dagger board can't do. The 380 have a better VMG.

320 is perfect for the Hybrid class while the 380 is perfect for the Race-Board Class

VDB wins many World Tittle in this class, so definitely faster than the Mistral Equipe II, Fanatic Mega Cat of F2 Ligthning

All the best

Per · 8th April 2007, 01:09 AM

Hi Remi
I'm curious about this, but don't really get your point.
Will the 380 sail with the dagger board down in high winds? (what are high winds, 20 knots, 30 knots??)
Won't the 320 with a wider tail (better fin carrying ability) be able to point higher and go lower downwind??

Won't the 320 with the wide tail plane earlier??

2nd April 2007, 05:24 AM	#1
Guest Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 1,321	Phantom 380 vs. Competitors Anyone have any experiences, or educated guesses, as to how Starboard's Phantom 380 raceboard stacks up against the competition? It looks a little more traditional than the exocet warp-x. What makes it faster than the raceboards of a few years back like the mistral superlight? Another thing is that it seems like the back of the mast track is pretty far forward - will that make it hard to use the board in fully-planing mode? When is the first race where it will make an appearance, and will there be online coverage?

2nd April 2007, 06:26 AM	#2
Remi STARBOARD DEVELOPMENT Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Thailand Posts: 2,334	RE: Phantom 380 vs. Competitors Hi Guest, We devellope the Phantom race 380 against the best Race-Board ever : VDB. We make some modification on this board who increase his performance : Plane earlier due to the 70cm wide. A lot more stable with this wide. Get on the rail a lot quicker with the 85cm dagger board. So in realy light winds this board is really faster compare to the VDB. In medium and high wind the Phantom Race 380 keep the legendary speed of the VDB but more easy. So we increase in all compartment the performances of the best Race Board ever. You have a long mast track on this board to feat all size sails 6.5 to 9.5mÂ². In the past the limit was 7.5mÂ². The back position is perfect for fully planing mode, for sure is not the same position as a iSonic May be at the French Champioship in may, but not sure. All the best __________________ Rémi Can answer if you have any questions on this following boards : Carve 111, 121, 131, 141, 151 & 161 Futura 93, 101, 111, 121, 131 & 141. iSonic 80, 87, 90, 97, 107, 110, 117, 127 & 137 To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. UltraSonic 147 Formula Experience One Design Phantom Race 377/320 To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Phantom 295 : To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Formula 167 & 167 Wide : To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Racing Serinity Cat Concept To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

2nd April 2007, 07:24 AM	#3
Randy Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 55	RE: Phantom 380 vs. Competitors What was the VDB?

2nd April 2007, 03:28 PM	#4
Remi STARBOARD DEVELOPMENT Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Thailand Posts: 2,334	RE: Phantom 380 vs. Competitors Hi Randy, Vand Den Berg Board All the best __________________ Rémi Can answer if you have any questions on this following boards : Carve 111, 121, 131, 141, 151 & 161 Futura 93, 101, 111, 121, 131 & 141. iSonic 80, 87, 90, 97, 107, 110, 117, 127 & 137 To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. UltraSonic 147 Formula Experience One Design Phantom Race 377/320 To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Phantom 295 : To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Formula 167 & 167 Wide : To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Racing Serinity Cat Concept To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

2nd April 2007, 10:19 PM	#5
Ken Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Dallas, Texas USA Posts: 797	RE: Phantom 380 vs. Competitors No doubt the VDB was an excellent board (I have never seen one), but my old Equipe II XR was a great board too. My largest sail at the time was a Neil Pryde light wind racer 10.6 with no twist. I wonder why the Phantom is limited to a 9.5? Was the VDB never raced in light winds (7.5 sail)? If I ever go back to a race board again, it needs to perform in 3-10 knots with an 11.0. Any reason why the Phantom can't peform in really light winds with a big sail? For many of us in the US, the only reason to have a race board is for light wind racing, and many of us live where the wind is pretty light most of the time. Ken __________________ Toys: Formula 160; iSonic 111; HiFly Move 105; Tiga 263; '85 Mistral Superlight. Maui Sails TR 11.0; 9.2; 8.4; 7.6; 6.6; Maui Sails Switch 6.0; 5.2; Maui Sails Global 4.5; 4.0.

4th April 2007, 12:30 AM	#6
James Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 235	RE: Phantom 380 vs. Competitors Ken Wrote: "I wonder why the Phantom is limited to a 9.5?" I don't think the board is physically limited to a 9.5, in fact it would probably do great with a 10.6 or 11.0 in light winds. ? I think board lists 9.5 as the top of the sail range simply because that's the max size allowed in the international raceboard class. I have a question for board about how the phantom 380 and 320 are to be sailed. Is upwind VMG on both boards always best with the daggerboard down and mast track forward? Or is there a wind strength where you put the mast track back and sail at all headings on the fin alone, as with formula and wide hybrids? If so, about what wind strength is it for both boards? (BTW I am the "guest" that started this thread.)

4th April 2007, 04:39 AM	#7
Ken Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Dallas, Texas USA Posts: 797	RE: Phantom 380 vs. Competitors James, Good point on the 9.5 sail size limit for the race board class. I seriously doubt the 380 could do better upwind with the dagger board fully retracted. The 320 may be another story with the wider tail and longer (slalom?) fin. It appears the the 380 will be better in light winds and the 320 in stronger winds. The question is - where is the break even point, where both get around the course in the same time? Somewhere around 10 to 15 knots? Ken __________________ Toys: Formula 160; iSonic 111; HiFly Move 105; Tiga 263; '85 Mistral Superlight. Maui Sails TR 11.0; 9.2; 8.4; 7.6; 6.6; Maui Sails Switch 6.0; 5.2; Maui Sails Global 4.5; 4.0.

5th April 2007, 11:31 PM	#8
James Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 235	RE: Phantom 380 vs. Competitors http://stableroad.com/videos/bsy3bahamas.htm I found this sweet video from 1987 when I was looking for pictures of the famed "VDB". It shows some very fast and fun looking longboard racing, along with slalom. Maybe daggerboards ARE cool. Van den Berg is in it, but I don't know if he's riding his most famous board or not.

6th April 2007, 01:48 AM	#9
Remi STARBOARD DEVELOPMENT Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Thailand Posts: 2,334	RE: Phantom 380 vs. Competitors Hi James and Ken, 380 vs 320 in high winds = 380 win for multiple reasons : The 380 is in wood technologie while the 320 is in tufskin, so 380 is more light. 380 do a real good angle event in strong wind that 320 with out the dagger board can't do. The 380 have a better VMG. 320 is perfect for the Hybrid class while the 380 is perfect for the Race-Board Class VDB wins many World Tittle in this class, so definitely faster than the Mistral Equipe II, Fanatic Mega Cat of F2 Ligthning All the best __________________ Rémi Can answer if you have any questions on this following boards : Carve 111, 121, 131, 141, 151 & 161 Futura 93, 101, 111, 121, 131 & 141. iSonic 80, 87, 90, 97, 107, 110, 117, 127 & 137 To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. UltraSonic 147 Formula Experience One Design Phantom Race 377/320 To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Phantom 295 : To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Formula 167 & 167 Wide : To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Racing Serinity Cat Concept To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

8th April 2007, 01:09 AM	#10
Per Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 237	RE: Phantom 380 vs. Competitors Hi Remi I'm curious about this, but don't really get your point. Will the 380 sail with the dagger board down in high winds? (what are high winds, 20 knots, 30 knots??) Won't the 320 with a wider tail (better fin carrying ability) be able to point higher and go lower downwind?? Won't the 320 with the wide tail plane earlier??

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