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Old 20th November 2007, 07:04 AM   #21
Del Carpenter
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In considering which class to add also consider how the existing classes will be affected. Some of the racers in the new class will drop out of previous classes.

I'm convinced the future growth of windsurfing and racing will come from the raceboard class because the boards are so versatile. The next time I have to replace either my longboard or my formula board the new board will be in the raceboard class.
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Old 20th November 2007, 07:14 AM   #22
Egor
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what about light wind slalom, 12 knots is plenty. I dont know if formula is the way, its been around for a few years now and hasnt really taken off. The problem is the gear is just to big
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Old 20th November 2007, 10:51 PM   #23
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There's so much misinformation above about formula class, most people I know that
race formula avg. income, fit but not super strong or big (I'm 135 lb, 5'6"),
there was a comment about fins, there's one fin that currently in demand 'Kashy',
the rest are reasonably priced and you can buy many high quility customs used,
it's not the latest fin that's going to win you a race, it's your skill!
also Formula Experience boards would reduce usable wind range of the boards, specially
light wind by couple of knots, so I wouldn't do it just based on that.
We just had a great race in Miami with 2 classes, Formula and Kona, both classes
had a great time, but even in the light winds Formula plained thru most of the races.

check out, www.miamiwindsurfing.com
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Old 21st November 2007, 12:13 AM   #24
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2 more interesing facts,
at last 'slalom' race at calema, top guys where on the fw gear.

as your racing group gets larger, the avg. price of gear
drops way down, since people with more income tend to buy gear
every year/ or even more often and used stuff treakls down to the
rest of the group, at around ~ 10-15 active racers it very abvious
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Old 21st November 2007, 02:38 AM   #25
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I agree that there is much misinformation about formula out there. In the USA the formula fleets have the most sailors, and the most serious sailors, so to say that formula never took off is flat out wrong. Also, a good sailor with used gear will always beat a lesser sailor with the best gear. The arms race is way overstated. There is a lot of used formula gear out there to be had, so it isn't all that expensive. You really only need one board, two sails (11.0, 9.0 for small people, 12.0, 10.0 for big people) and one fin. It is true that the best sailors finish way in front of the more novice, but isn't that the way it should be. I don't know about you, but I want to be rewarded for my time on the water, overall fitness, and race tactics. Racing is one thing, but I can't imagine training on a longboard. When it is 10 mph, I can't think of a better set-up than formula and when it is 20-30 it is very intense and hair-raising (going fast is fun!). I wouldn't want to be on my lake in under 7 mph anyways no matter what board, after all "wind" is part of windsurfing. When it rains golf is cancelled, and in my mind when there is no wind, windsurfing is cancelled. I'm okay with that.

P
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Old 21st November 2007, 04:23 AM   #26
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"after all "wind" is part of windsurfing."

Sure, the sport is "windsurfing" - but 7 knots of wind IS wind. On the other hand, there's no "surf" on flat water.....so by your measure, Formula in 20 knots on SF Bay is not "windsurfing", but just "windflatwatering"....or maybe "galechoping". In the ocean it'd be "breezeswellering". :-)

It'd be easier to just accept that even 1 knot of wind is "wind", and the "surf" part comes from the fact that we stand on something like a surfboard.

And of course, the "Windsurfer" label came from 12 foot boards designed mainly for light winds. The original board is still a Windsurfer, even if it's sailed in 2 knots and flat water, and in the same way other longboards are still windsurfers.

If you don't want to sail in light winds that's great. Whatever floats your boat (or board). But let's allow for the fact that many people in club racing want to be able to go down to sail at a certain time each week, and in most places that means regularly sailing in light winds. The alternative is that people start not turning up unless it's breezy, and then the fleet can gradually fade away as people get out of the habit.

The other thing is that one way windsurfing can easily get the infrastructure it needs (and get visibility in front of kids) is by becoming a part of an established sailing club, and they tend to dislike having to organise racing for a bunch of people who don't turn up unless there's a planing breeze.
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Old 21st November 2007, 05:45 AM   #27
James
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Post #25, are you sure the formula fleets are bigger in the US? Because in my area the longboard fleets are bigger and have more locals, whereas the formula racers have to come from 100s of miles away just to gather a small fleet for a race.

I wish the best for the formula discipline- I think it is a great form of windsurfing competition. But I don't think that it can exist without a broad base of longboard class racing to develop new sailors and allow fleets to exist in areas with less-than-ideal wind and water access.

It would be interesting to know how most formula racers got into formula racing. I bet the majority started with longboard racing. Or even if they came into formula racing from recreational shortboard sailing, then I bet they usually came into recreational shortboard sailing from a longboard. What do other people think?
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Old 21st November 2007, 08:06 AM   #28
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You do need min ~10 knots to have a FW course race enviroment, so
if your area avg. below that than raceboards might be a better option

As for background of FW racers, if they started windsurfing 15 years ago or
in some third world country with limited excess to modern gear, than yes
most did race longboards prior

But if you started later and had budget/access to short boards,
than it's short board->FW

For some I know, formula was the first board after couple of begginer lessons
It's so stable, it's easy for begginer to use and you definetly don't outgrow it!
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Old 21st November 2007, 08:33 AM   #29
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Let's be frank here. There are sailors that work off of wind, and those that don't. That's really reality here. But, we all have to decide whether it's worth our time.

For me, I'm not a racer, but I don't waste time trying to be windsurfing when the conditions aren't right. Not the ultimate engine for sparking participation, but let's be realitistic. If your want the best focus, the conditions have to be practical. An argument can be presented otherwise, but the conditions are truly paramount.

If you consider a location like SF Bay, do they regularly race during the winter and early spring months? I don't think so. Yet, folks take advantage of conditions to optimize things, even during the "off" months. Really, that's where you can develop strength.

Of course, out in nowhere land, that might not make as much sense. But, in the continental US, and much of the world that might experience a true winter, folks take a break and concentrate on different activities. When a certain amount of reality hits, folks plan accordingly.

While looking at competition and racing in the summer months, it just might be that the event is scheduled during a period of little or no wind. Some might advocate the event nonetheless, but I guess the question can be asked whether that brings strength to the sport.

I know as a surfer (the traditional type on a surfboard), I didn't get foolish or adamant about the scene unless "real surf" existed. Otherwise, the exercise lacked the necessary ingredients to be realistic. Of course shams have been conducted in the past, with true results, but all dedicated folks know the real game. Stuff has to have gravity.

Last edited by steveC; 21st November 2007 at 08:37 AM.
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Old 21st November 2007, 09:52 AM   #30
windstock anarchy
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Quote:
Hi, we are looking in our region to add one new class to our race calendar.
I assume this will be the first windsurfing class in your region that you ever had on your calendar of races.

Quote:
We are looking for a class with this characteristics:

- Fun factor
- More 18 - 45 years oriented
- Less price to be competitive much better
- Atractive international events to participate
- Fun factor
I love racing. The racing can be frustrating. i.e. Travel 500 miles to go to an event and there's not enough wind for the centerboard class to finish a course. Not fun!

It is still worth it for me because it helps me stay connected to the rest of the race and event junkies in our region. It is often the only time to get together and catch up, trade stories, party. Always fun!

- More 18 - 45 years oriented
Last event I attended youngest was 15 oldest 60 in the fw class.

We also had the kona class that Bruce won. I've never asked how old he is, but he has movies from windsurfing events in the 70s. I'm sure he's lurking around the free forum somewhere.

- Less price to be competitive much better

Well if you purchased all new FW stuff, and some that I race with do almost every year. You could invest 6k to 12k US$ on 4 sails, 2mast, 2booms, 3 fins, 2boards.
(One Apollo for those wind min events and one 162 for those events that never drop below 10 knots).
Price will also depend on how well you know your distributer. (Nobody retails racing stuff anymore)


I have never seen the point of Formula Experience. If you want to experience Formula windsurfing buy some used Formula stuff.
For example, some recent purchases I know about in this region; 2005, F2 formula board $300.00, 2007 10.7 rs6 sail 350.00 , 260cm to 310cm boom 250.00, mast 100% carbon 400.00, Fin Techtonics 68cm 50.00us.

The FE class came and went around here. There's some used to buy, but I can buy good used FW equipment for less, so what's the point.
OK so if I wanted to race FE class I would have to have a 75% carbon, (they still brake too) class approved mast, class approved free race sail, and class approved aluminum boom (this boom wouldn't last me one season).http://http://www.formulawindsurfing...ss/rule06.html
The FW class has an approved board list thatís it.
http://http://www.formulawindsurfing.org/index.php

INTERNATIONAL
RACEBOARD class


http://http://www.sailing.org/tools/documents/RAC_2005_CR_050408-[889].pdf

I did start racing on long boards. Never did well and I did not even have 1/4th the fun I have sailing FW. I a heavy, 95kg, and didn't/couldn't afford to sail bigger than the 7.5 limit, They would split into weight classes if possible, but it was a real drag to be the last to cross the finish line every time.
I could see this INTERNATIONAL
RACEBOARD class

turning into a real gear war. It looks as though anything with a centerboard is leagel. There has to be a huge difference in performance between the class boards to chose form.
There are no weight splits rules that I can find. No matter what equipment I have the lighties can have the same. In light wind events i would have no reason to go to the start line.

This last weekends FW event I raced, weight was not a factor. It was leap frog racing, much fun. Races were won by 90kg racers and 70kg racers on new 2008 equipment and older stuff.

We do our best to accommodate all who would like to race
so we had one RSX and one long board in the fleet.
Then there was the Kona class.

A few FW racers have converted to Kona class. When word got out that a decent custom FW fin would set you back 800.00 they got into the Kona class. I'm sure they still have their FW gear though.
Kona is one design so at most events charters will be available.
Kona has weight brakes. >187 you can use 9.0 <187lbs 7.5 no pumping allowed, works out real well.

- Atractive international events to participate

Being down in the South Florida Republic, I can say that all of our events our international.

This is what happens in this region.
FW class makes the event calendar happen, but we know we can't do it without the participation of the one design and long board classes, which started it all in the first place.

Thatís all I have to add to this for now




The best governing body in no governing body at all.
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