Formula Windsurfing One Design – Olympic 2012 - Page 12

17th June 2008, 03:51 AM

Judging by latest race report, Allison Shreeve is proving that proposed format works
really well, (conditions 4- 40knots), and she did great even in super light
conditions agains guys who can plane on a wisper with latest custom fins and jumbo sails:
I'm for one is impressed, check it out:
http://www.miamiwindsurfing.com/usaformula.html

Ken · 17th June 2008, 08:46 PM

Fattyfattybonbon,

You said -

"The formula board claims that it can plane really early in as little as 6 knots, but once it surpasses 15 knots, its performance deteriorates almost instantly. It starts to waver and control gets out of hand. Also, the formula board is harder to pump."

I can't let this go without a comment. Either you have never sailed formula or at best, very little. NOTHING can stay with a formula board in 15 to 25 knots (upwind and downwind). Performance does not deteriorate above 15 knots, it just gets more exciting. The amount of "waver" and "control" depends on the skill of the sailor. Beginners and novices on Formula will have problems when the wind picks up, but not the experienced sailor. You just have to practice, you know - TOW.

Pumping is extremely effective on Formula. With the wide board and 70cm fin, pumping on plane in winds under 10 knots isn't hard and once on plane in 10 knots of wind, reaching 18-20 knots of board speed isn't out of the question.

In regards to what should be the Olympic board - I have mixed feelings so I am not taking a side. I love formula, but trying to race formula in 6 to 8 knots will only work well for the lightest sailors, which is also true for the hybrid boards. As the wind picks up, the the heavyweights may have an advantage. No way around this.

I have raced formula in 6-9 knots where only a third of the fleet was able to plane around the course, with the majority slogging or not able to make much of a gain upwind. Good for me since I am on the lightweight side (79kg), but bad for the heavyweights.

Ken

17th June 2008, 11:04 PM

Hi Sergio

was Allison using the women 9.5m2 in the light day, or 11m2 men's rig? If it was on the 9.5m2 it would mean a lot about Allison and FWOD concept.

I am also intrigued by the race course shape.

"windward leeward/M slalom course on the outer loop"

is it M slalom part very often used? From my ignorance I would say that would be useful in very light winds to avoid loose planing in deep deep downwind run. Is this its purpose?
But it must be crazy in high winds, mustn't it? In the reaching slalom legs one must be very very overpowered. Am I right?

Best regards

Marc

Quote:

Originally Posted by sergio k

Judging by latest race report, Allison Shreeve is proving that proposed format works
really well, (conditions 4- 40knots), and she did great even in super light
conditions agains guys who can plane on a wisper with latest custom fins and jumbo sails:
I'm for one is impressed, check it out:
http://www.miamiwindsurfing.com/usaformula.html

18th June 2008, 04:45 AM

Hi all,

Last week I was in Thailand and had the chance to test the FOD in different conditions.

Every piece of the equipment is working really well, but the most impressive surprise is the alloy boom. It's really stiff with the 11.0 sail and just the boom by itself could bring a totally new breath for the FW and FE classes. At the end of the first day I had to ask Remi if that boom was the FOD alloy boom or a carbon version. Actually there is no carbon version, that stiff boom is the FOD alloy boom!!

The FW 162 board is already known by most Formula sailors. For sure it's the easiest Starboard FW board to sail fast.

The sail is very easy to rig and works in a huge range. I tested the FOD 3 days: 7-10 knots at the first day, 13-16 on the second day and up to 20 knots at the third day (6.0s and smaller iSonics and Futuras planning everywhere).

The kit worked fine in all conditions (I'm 82 kg) and I have no doubt that the FOD is clearly a great solution for racing.

18th June 2008, 09:57 PM

Marc, I wasn't there but here's a quote from latest detail report:
"She did extremely well using the 9.5m women’s rig and the 11m men’s rig, depending on the conditions and a second non-kit fin all within the formula rules but not keeping to the One Design format against the more open formula fleet."

Very interesting, and it sort off, makes me think again, that with a second fin ( not much
extra cost or storage space) one can really help to impove the range, would be nice to have an option of a 2nd sail but that might be too much to ask from 'one design' concept .

Hopefully Allisson will jump on the forum and gives her own feed back soon

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarcCasaldaliga

Hi Sergio

was Allison using the women 9.5m2 in the light day, or 11m2 men's rig? If it was on the 9.5m2 it would mean a lot about Allison and FWOD concept.

I am also intrigued by the race course shape.

"windward leeward/M slalom course on the outer loop"

is it M slalom part very often used? From my ignorance I would say that would be useful in very light winds to avoid loose planing in deep deep downwind run. Is this its purpose?
But it must be crazy in high winds, mustn't it? In the reaching slalom legs one must be very very overpowered. Am I right?

Best regards

Marc

19th June 2008, 05:58 AM

way overpowered beam reaching a 70 cm fin

19th June 2008, 06:06 PM

Hi all, thanks unregistered for the clarification:

in second report of US WINDSURFING NATIONALS things come a little more clear:
"She did extremely well using the 9.5m women’s rig and the 11m men’s rig, depending on the conditions and a second non-kit fin all within the formula rules but not keeping to the One Design format against the more open formula fleet."

BUT, if she needed to use the 11m2 men's rig in lightwinds, that's cheating!
I mean, it is misleading information saying that she was succesful in any condition with FWOD. Women FWOD is only 9.5m2! I quote The suspicous statement:

"Following pack up Allison held a presentation of the Formula Windsurfing One Design equipment on the beach where most of the racers attended. Many technical questions were asked, but most of all people were pleased with the performance of the equipment from 4-40knots of wind with one kit. "
http://www.miamiwindsurfing.com/usaformula.html

The achievement of overal 3rd (great!) then is due to Allison skills and not to strict FWOD!

IMHO, I think one should be more careful with that kind of misleading or partial statements, specially when 1 rig solution is underdiscussion.

Best regards

Marc

19th June 2008, 07:30 PM

I dont see any issue with Allison using 2 rigs. What she has shown is that the FOD equipment is competitive in an open formula fleet. Does it matter she used two rigs, she is a lightweight sailor, I am certain the other sailors (possibly even heavier) used multiple rigs too!

I am sure that the sails would not have been as comfy as the full on formula sails, but that was never implied. These sails have always been marketed as compromise sails, with extended range at the expense of not being the absolutely optimal foils for given windspeeds.

Starboard appear to have shown that the FOD gear that can work within a normal Formula fleet.

Good for them,

JB

19th June 2008, 08:23 PM

I think, to be honest, She would use only the 9.5 rig to show the kit works in light winds or not. That's the problem. I think She wouldn't be planning in very light winds with the 9.5.
One thing is: The FOD works well with 2 rigs and 1 fin with the "open" formula kits, other thing is: The FOD kit works with the 9.5 rig in 6 knots, for woman. I don't think it works with the 9.5 in light winds.

19th June 2008, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unregistered

I think, to be honest, She would use only the 9.5 rig to show the kit works in light winds or not. That's the problem. I think She wouldn't be planning in very light winds with the 9.5.
One thing is: The FOD works well with 2 rigs and 1 fin with the "open" formula kits, other thing is: The FOD kit works with the 9.5 rig in 6 knots, for woman. I don't think it works with the 9.5 in light winds.

Actually, if you got the skills and you're light <160 lb, you can plane with 9.5 in 6 knots,
I do it all the time,
what supprised me (and would've being amazing!) that she won against guys on 12m sails on her 9.5 m2 ( Fernando, aspecially, is super efficient in light winds with 11.8m),
but her using 11m cleares that up...
SB never said that the rig would be faster against FULL ON formula class,
but planning in light winds is definetly a FACT of life. Results do show that
FOD is very effective but a compromise against formula fleet

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17th June 2008, 03:51 AM	#111
sergio k Guest Posts: n/a	Judging by latest race report, Allison Shreeve is proving that proposed format works really well, (conditions 4- 40knots), and she did great even in super light conditions agains guys who can plane on a wisper with latest custom fins and jumbo sails: I'm for one is impressed, check it out: http://www.miamiwindsurfing.com/usaformula.html

17th June 2008, 08:46 PM	#112
Ken Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Dallas, Texas USA Posts: 797	Fattyfattybonbon, You said - "The formula board claims that it can plane really early in as little as 6 knots, but once it surpasses 15 knots, its performance deteriorates almost instantly. It starts to waver and control gets out of hand. Also, the formula board is harder to pump." I can't let this go without a comment. Either you have never sailed formula or at best, very little. NOTHING can stay with a formula board in 15 to 25 knots (upwind and downwind). Performance does not deteriorate above 15 knots, it just gets more exciting. The amount of "waver" and "control" depends on the skill of the sailor. Beginners and novices on Formula will have problems when the wind picks up, but not the experienced sailor. You just have to practice, you know - TOW. Pumping is extremely effective on Formula. With the wide board and 70cm fin, pumping on plane in winds under 10 knots isn't hard and once on plane in 10 knots of wind, reaching 18-20 knots of board speed isn't out of the question. In regards to what should be the Olympic board - I have mixed feelings so I am not taking a side. I love formula, but trying to race formula in 6 to 8 knots will only work well for the lightest sailors, which is also true for the hybrid boards. As the wind picks up, the the heavyweights may have an advantage. No way around this. I have raced formula in 6-9 knots where only a third of the fleet was able to plane around the course, with the majority slogging or not able to make much of a gain upwind. Good for me since I am on the lightweight side (79kg), but bad for the heavyweights. Ken

18th June 2008, 04:45 AM	#114
Morrone Guest Posts: n/a	Hi all, Last week I was in Thailand and had the chance to test the FOD in different conditions. Every piece of the equipment is working really well, but the most impressive surprise is the alloy boom. It's really stiff with the 11.0 sail and just the boom by itself could bring a totally new breath for the FW and FE classes. At the end of the first day I had to ask Remi if that boom was the FOD alloy boom or a carbon version. Actually there is no carbon version, that stiff boom is the FOD alloy boom!! The FW 162 board is already known by most Formula sailors. For sure it's the easiest Starboard FW board to sail fast. The sail is very easy to rig and works in a huge range. I tested the FOD 3 days: 7-10 knots at the first day, 13-16 on the second day and up to 20 knots at the third day (6.0s and smaller iSonics and Futuras planning everywhere). The kit worked fine in all conditions (I'm 82 kg) and I have no doubt that the FOD is clearly a great solution for racing.

19th June 2008, 05:58 AM	#116
Unregistered Guest Posts: n/a	way overpowered beam reaching a 70 cm fin

19th June 2008, 06:06 PM	#117
MarcCasaldaliga Guest Posts: n/a	Hi all, thanks unregistered for the clarification: in second report of US WINDSURFING NATIONALS things come a little more clear: "She did extremely well using the 9.5m women’s rig and the 11m men’s rig, depending on the conditions and a second non-kit fin all within the formula rules but not keeping to the One Design format against the more open formula fleet." BUT, if she needed to use the 11m2 men's rig in lightwinds, that's cheating! I mean, it is misleading information saying that she was succesful in any condition with FWOD. Women FWOD is only 9.5m2! I quote The suspicous statement: "Following pack up Allison held a presentation of the Formula Windsurfing One Design equipment on the beach where most of the racers attended. Many technical questions were asked, but most of all people were pleased with the performance of the equipment from 4-40knots of wind with one kit. " http://www.miamiwindsurfing.com/usaformula.html The achievement of overal 3rd (great!) then is due to Allison skills and not to strict FWOD! IMHO, I think one should be more careful with that kind of misleading or partial statements, specially when 1 rig solution is underdiscussion. Best regards Marc

19th June 2008, 07:30 PM	#118
Unregistered Guest Posts: n/a	I dont see any issue with Allison using 2 rigs. What she has shown is that the FOD equipment is competitive in an open formula fleet. Does it matter she used two rigs, she is a lightweight sailor, I am certain the other sailors (possibly even heavier) used multiple rigs too! I am sure that the sails would not have been as comfy as the full on formula sails, but that was never implied. These sails have always been marketed as compromise sails, with extended range at the expense of not being the absolutely optimal foils for given windspeeds. Starboard appear to have shown that the FOD gear that can work within a normal Formula fleet. Good for them, JB

19th June 2008, 08:23 PM	#119
Unregistered Guest Posts: n/a	I think, to be honest, She would use only the 9.5 rig to show the kit works in light winds or not. That's the problem. I think She wouldn't be planning in very light winds with the 9.5. One thing is: The FOD works well with 2 rigs and 1 fin with the "open" formula kits, other thing is: The FOD kit works with the 9.5 rig in 6 knots, for woman. I don't think it works with the 9.5 in light winds.