Old 21st February 2010, 02:31 AM   #11
Lanee
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Hey Joe. I don't mean to offend. Please understand that when people come up to me and want to rerig my sail in a way that is ouside recommendations, I politely say, 'thanks, I'll consider that'. It gets a little worse when they actually grab my rig and start doing it. On rare occasions, I've had to resort to getting the hard copy of my rigging manual out of the car. I usually avoid discussions about why they want me to rig my sail differently than recommended. I just assume that somebody showed them how to rig a sail once, and they're assuming all sails should be rigged the same way.
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Old 21st February 2010, 05:54 AM   #12
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More downhaul and outhaul both will flatten a sail and de-power it. However, downhauling will also loosen the leach and add more twist which outhauling won't.

Rigging to specifications if on the correct mast doesn't always mean that the sail is rigged correctly. New sails need to streatch a bit before you can reach the correct downhaul without over doing it. Older sails may need a bit more dowhaul to get them right.

Mast extensions are all a little different than their marking in centimeters indicate.

Variations from the recommended downhaul and outhaul are normal for additional power or decreased power based on conditions.

Bottom line is that it takes experience to see and feel if the sail is rigged correctly. There is no one correct answer. Many people may think they have it correct when it's not.
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Old 21st February 2010, 07:18 AM   #13
joe_windsurfer
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hey Lanee - no offense taken

i AM a wannabe windsurfer - just wanna get past that intermediate stage

i am a numbers guy and very visual - i rig by eye, but that works for me
and NO-ONE touches my rig !!! {actually did lend it more than once or twice though}
guys touching your rig, is a male superiority issue !!!
locally we have a formula gal that tells the guys how to rig !!!

we can't we all just get along ?? eternal question for mankind
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Last edited by joe_windsurfer; 21st February 2010 at 10:07 AM.
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Old 21st February 2010, 10:21 AM   #14
Lanee
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Hey Eric! What brand, model, and year sails do you have? What masts do you have? Hopefully, you have the recommended masts. If you do, we can all take a look at the online rigging guides together.

There's really no magic to it and no real experience needed to rig correctly UNLESS your sail only has measurements. The easiest sails have the visual indicators on them that I mentioned earlier. The next easiest group of sails will have a guide showing pictures of what the sail will look like when rigged correctly. They may say something like 'for maximum power, downhaul the sail until the crease on the second panel extends 1/4 in' or something like that.

Those sails that don't have any pictures or indicators, and only have cm ranges for outhaul and downhaul get confusing. Folks get a picture in their minds about what a sail is supposed to look like (since there are no REAL pictures), and rig it that way. It may look nothing like what the designer meant for it to look like. Look at 9. on this link http://www.sailworks.com/web/documen...fw/rigging.cfm vs. the sail in this link http://www.aerotechsails.com/09_manual.pdf. If you rig all of your sails the same way, you'll have problems.
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Old 21st February 2010, 05:07 PM   #15
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To me it sounds like you're being givin the advice to gain more power by reducing the downhaul. In my opinion this is wrong. Yes you will have more power, but because of the bad aerodynamics and poor control you won't really achive anything by it.
I am pretty sure that most pro slalom sailors never mess with their downhaul. So why should you. Find a setting where you have good control and good power. And adjust the power of the sail with your outhaul.
Wavesailors, and freestylers adjust the dowhaul., but to my understanding, this is to gain more spin when looping and doing sin moves.
My own theory: You dont need to catch any wind to produce power. Think about it. if all the wind stays in the sail it would be like throwing a big balloon through the air. and if you have ever tried that you know the ballon wont go far. It creates huge amounts of turbulence behind it. that way actually sucking you backwards. But if you untie the ballon so that the air will be directed backwards(like the leach of the sail), it will go with huge speeds flying around the room.
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Old 21st February 2010, 08:05 PM   #16
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since we have discussed some brand names here and there may be no "correct" answer --- there are many views, may i suggest the following :

go with the sail provider

since i use MS, i use the forum and e-mail contacts @ MS
SW also has contacts and even BP will answer you directly

sail specs will include suggested masts and sometimes alternatives, but in the sail forums alternatives may also be discussed....
downhauls, outhauls are all discussed ...

in the end, i stay with what i said - it comes down to what works for you
just yesterday i had a chat with a fellow who does wave and B&J
he likes his boom way lower than i have ever tried it
he has way more experience than i and i do NOT do wave nor B&J
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Old 21st February 2010, 09:56 PM   #17
eric b 125
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i checked out the rigging guide that came with one of my sails, and i've also visited the gaastra website, to see the proper rigging of the sails i have. i'm just not sure what the +/- downhaul and outhaul do to the sail's performance. i've been doing as much reading as i can and asking whatever questions i have since i wont be able to do any trial and error for a few months. i'll read posts about sail size and wind force, and there will inevitably be a response about, "try giving 1 cm more downhaul", "next time ease up on the outhaul". and i never understood, why?

i have two sails: an 8.5 gaastra maxtrix on a 490, and a 6.5 gaastra pilot on a 460. (both sails are 2008) the reason i am concerned with the forces that are involved, is so i can tune my sails if i want more power for the 8.5, or less power in the 6.5. or would you guys suggest just rigging to gaastra's specs and forgetting trying to get more or less out of the sails?
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Old 21st February 2010, 10:00 PM   #18
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Eric, in the future, please give us the details of your rig, conditions you sail in and yourself when asking questions. That way we can give specific answers based on your size, where you sail, your board and sail.

The following are rigging instructions I use for rigging clinics at club meetings. They are based on Sailworks sails but work for any new generation sail.

Downhaul controls base power of sail by controlling shape of the foil in sail, by changing downhaul I can sail a 5.4 in either 24 mph or 32 mph of wind. Outhaul then finalizes sail tension out to clew and should always be reset when downhaul is changed. Outhaul can be used to add or subtract small amounts of power.


Rigging:
Lay sail out, note measurements, try to adjust top short so normal sailing is in the second hole or more on a 2 cm extension. Tape mast together. Insert into mast sleeve trying to keep sail from bunching.
Insert line into pulleys. Downhaul lightly to approx 1 shakra from bottom. Attach boom at bottom of cutout. Tension outhaul loosely (non chambered). Downhaul to where you want power to be based on manufactures recommendations using marks on sail. You can also look at the batten above the boom. Should be in middle of boom with outhaul set. Set boom height to what you like. Tension outhaul to neutral (fingers slides on line.) then add 2 to 3 cm more outhaul. When you adjust downhaul you must readjust outhaul.
Tighten battens. Lower battens will be tensioned higher. Look along batten pocket and get rid of wrinkles. On new sail recheck at regular intervals.
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Old 21st February 2010, 10:13 PM   #19
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Forgot to login when I posted the above. Also agree that Guy Cribb article has some fluky instructions.
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Old 21st February 2010, 10:33 PM   #20
eric b 125
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vikingsail: i'm 5'11'', 90kg. most of the time i sail flatwater, 15mph winds. all of my equipment is brand new: '09 futura technora 144 (stock fin), the above sails, both my masts are fiberspar 3200 (30%), chinook triple clamp boom.

my equipment is far from 'top of the line' but it's all a huge step forward from the early 90's equipment that i used last year.
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