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Old 4th January 2007, 10:59 AM   #11
GEM
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Default RE: Replacing a 105L Hyper

Well, I would include the iS101 in my category of 100-110L boards. Barely, but it's in there.

Even though you are wanting SPEED, where the 94 probably outdoes the 101, it won't do that in marginal conditions. So even though you're limiting your wind range a bit, I'd STILL go for the bigger of the two (i.e., the 101). The main reason is that, statistically, you're more likely to have marginal wind that powered-up wind. So I would spend my money where the odds are greater. If you don't, the only valid reason in my view would be to go for maximum speed.

Best of luck!
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Old 4th January 2007, 01:21 PM   #12
geo
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Default RE: Replacing a 105L Hyper

Speedchaser,

please take note that I am strongly biased towards the fast efficient ride of narrower boards with smallish fins.
That said, it seems the trade off is between having an iS 94, that will SURELY work very nicely with a 7.6 and be perfect or almost so in fully powered 6.6 weather; and having an iS 101, that will handle the 7.6 even better and SURELY be faster and more competitive in marginal conditions... but, will it work AT ALL with a fully powered 6.6, 25 knots or more, for a 150 lbs. sailor? I guess it would for AA or for Ian, but both are more likely 200 lbs..

Some help from people who have experience of both HS and wide iS would be helpful here. From my experience of HS 105 and 111, they needed a fully committed ride, but that way they were able to swallow chop, literally; but my guess is that an iS 101 would be comparatively much more bouncy in big winds and chop.
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Old 5th January 2007, 01:29 AM   #13
steveC
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Default RE: Replacing a 105L Hyper

Hi Speedchaser,

In light of your latest post responding to Geoff's input, I thought I might come back for an added post.

In a recent thread, the discussion centered on the iS101, iS94 and iS87 boards, and one of the interesting questions was why the iS94. The principal thrust of the conversation was focused on picking a two board slalom quiver, and Ian Fox highlighted the iS101 and iS87 as the most ideal medium/high wind slalom quiver. However, it was also stressed that if one was thinking of only a single slalom board, the pick would clearly be the iS94, as it could more suitably balance both ends of the intended wind spectrum.

Because your latest comments you indicated that your interests centered on high powered sailing, and not on marginal conditions, I think that the scale more readily favors the iS94. If you were signifiicantly heavier (20-30lbs more), the path would point more obviously towards the iS101.

In answer to the question whether you could plane in 13 knots with the 7.6 and a 38cm fin, I have to side with geo and say yes, particularly because of your lighter weight. I know I can, and as I noted earlier, I'm just a tad heavier than you. In practice, I think that you can probably do it with even a smaller fin, like a 34 or 36. A 38cm fin might be a bit on the large side for a 59cm wide board, yet its viability has a lot to do with the physical and performance characteristics of the fin.

Overall, I hope this input helps you in our decision. Maybe Ian Fox will jump in and offer his thoughts. If available, I've found that he usually has a lot to say about the iSonics.

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Old 5th January 2007, 05:51 AM   #14
Ian Fox
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Default RE: Replacing a 105L Hyper

Hey... some very interesting and finely detailed discussions going on here. Good stuff. It's a very fine line between each perspective, and (strange enough) almost everyone above is correct in their own points.

In summary, one of the key differences remaining "open" is the choice of an ideal board (or quiver) for "slalom" c /w "speed" (in this case, GPS speed). Although basically the same thing, when it comes to the super fine levels of discussion here, we need to note (at least) 2 key factors : 1> Optimal "Slalom" board usually includes a higher % of choice weighting for range/accel/jibe/handling as well as potential (relative) upwind ability (esp in more marginal conditions for this board choice) - while with "speed" pretty much only Vmax (top end speed) potential counts and all other practical factors go back a long way in the ratings (noting in typical GPS speed use nothing counts as much as how fast in sheer top speed you can get that board going for 10 seconds) ...and 2> as GEM correctly identified, if speedchaser is using this (new) board in gusty, patchy (even if windy) inland lake conditions, then again the "optimal" choice can be (should be) correctly varied (from "typical" ) when considering variables down to the level of detail we are here.

Depending on your %focus on GPS speed (c/w lighter wind slalom racing - and note as opposed to lighter wind "slalom" B&F or drag racing, where accel and "upwind" matter less), I'd be siding more towards iS94 as geo and SteveC, BUT the weighting of GEM's point about speedchaser's gusty, patchy conditions can easily tip the very tight decision in favor if iS101.


Cheers ~ Ian

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Old 5th January 2007, 08:10 AM   #15
GEM
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Default RE: Replacing a 105L Hyper

Wow. This is one of the best threads I've seen in a while. I'm very humbled to play a role with the distinguished discussants.

Some thoughts on my biases...

I've watched since the early 90s, when I started windsurfing. I've seen a lot of people standing on the shore, waiting for sufficient wind to plane, when it's capping and 'wanting' to go off but not quite getting it. TYPICAL inland lake conditions, even great lakes, though the great lakes tend to be substantially less gusty than smaller inland lakes; the great lakes tend to be more up and down in ~90 second periods. Not as good as ocean sailing, but WAY better than little inland lakes. Lots of side shore to side-on frontside conditions.

In my view, there is NOTHING worse than sitting there knowing you could sail but not having a big enough kit. Getting good at WS'ing is all about time on water, and I think it really pays to have stuff to get out in light winds. EVEN FOR EXPERTS.

I think a lot of Formula advocates have the same view, and have decided to get huge stuff in order to plane in almost any conditions. I personally burned out on big stuff; it's just harder to use on my body than I care to venture (I get blisters on my hands). I'd rather do light wind freestyle or go running / cycling / whatever. So I think a lot of people got underboarded, and the reflex reaction was Formula. That was a good development in that it pushed the design envelope. That said, board designers, and *B in particular, have really learned a lot and offer more traditional volume boards that have range we never dreamed of in 1990.

Without question, I would therefore err on the side of larger board, and experiment extensively with fins, mast base, downhaul and outhaul. With the right fin, heavy railing pressure and the straps / mast way back, sheeted in as hard as you can (sail optimally set), my experience has been that heavy chop is dramatically easier because the board is not in the water very much. It's more like skipping from crest to crest, in a surprisingly smooth ride, but it requires tender foot and ankle work and being massively overpowered while sheeting in as hard as you can. That's my idea of fabulous 6.5 slalom / B&F sailing. You know you've got it right when it doesn't "feel" fast, but nobody can match you and the GPS numbers are impressive. In that mode, I would expect the iS101 to be more versatile, though a tad slower in maximum speed than the 94. I doubt you'll notice the difference, really, without formal racing or a GPS. To do it right, you'll need a fabulous race sail, top end mast and boom, and you can expect to break a lot of masts, booms, and even fins (done all of that, more than once each).

Of course, I'd do the same thing on the 94, but have to live with a 1-2 of knots less wind. Doesn't sound like much, but for Ontario that would translate to as many as 14 days a year, maybe more depending on your local access. I suggest you seek out records from Environment Canada and do your best to quantify what you would be missing.

You've had a lot of good opinions, I think. Nobody has the right answer, it's all what's right for you.

Best wishes.
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Old 5th January 2007, 08:47 AM   #16
steveC
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Default RE: Replacing a 105L Hyper

Hi Geoff,

Thanks for hanging tough on the conservative side of the fence, as I feel it was an important contribution. Being a local guy in Speedchaser's neck of the woods, I'm thinking that your input has particular interest that says much about what you've learned and have targeted in your personal focus. I have a 5 board quiver that includes a couple larger boards (still markedly narrow by today's standards), so I too can truly appreciate catching the lighter end of the wind spectrum to augment one's total sailing opportunities.

In his post, Speedchaser has fortunately seen a fair response to his questions, and the final decision is ultimately his. While I still wouldn't change my latest recommendation, I'm glad that he had some interesting input to work with.

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Old 5th January 2007, 08:49 AM   #17
SpeedChaser
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Default RE: Replacing a 105L Hyper

I'm glad everyone is taking their time to provide such useful constructive information. I really appreciate it.

Well, I have to say I was pretty much decided on the iS94...until your last post Geoff. I must say you make a very good point, and really, that's what my conscious is telling me. Although it would be fun to have the iS94 in real powered up conditions, I think it's just not practical for where I sail, at least as my big board in a 2 board quiver. I do sail with GPS but I'm sure the difference in speed is not enough to make the compromise in the low end range. I think I'll be much happier with the iS101 in the gusty conditions around here, and overall I'll have more fun, which is more important to me than GPS speed readings.

Thanks again everyone!
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Old 8th January 2007, 03:24 PM   #18
Erik Loots
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Default RE: Replacing a 105L Hyper

Hi,

I replaced my hypersonic 105 wood for an isonic 105 dram.

Difference: (1=bad 10=best)

hypersonic 105:
lowwind: 9
highwind flat water: 8
highwind choppy water: 5
highwind chaos water: 4
big sails: 9
small sails: 7

isonic 105:
lowwind: 8
highwind flat water: 9
highwind choppy water: 8
highwind chaos water: 7
big sails: 8
small sails: 7

My hypersonic was more allround and isonic range is just higher (read better in more wind)

hypersonic use 10-32 knots wind best performance was (for me) 12-22 knots wind
isonic use 12-36 knots wind best performance was (for me) 15-24 knots wind
isonic best performance

Depending on circumstances of use... I would choose

isonic 105 (101)
= more matchrace board
+gusty wind
+choppy
+average windspeed of 18knots

(i)sonic 95 (94)
= more slalom board
+constand wind
+open sea (lang waves)
+flat water
+average windspeed 22knots
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