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Old 14th June 2011, 08:21 PM   #1
nakaniko
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Default vote the gliding and planing

Like written on another hot windsurfing forum, I would know the opinion of windsurfers about the gliding vs planing of actual and past (not too much) boards, especially longboards with daggerboard.
I often see some longboards being sold on ebay at cheap prices, and so I dream of carrying over the roof of my car a board with daggerboard instead of my widebody flapper, so I could have the possibility of gliding even in small lakes with few knots. But I don't want to loose much planing ability. And I've see another Mistral Ventura 343 from 2009...
My Serenity is in Venice watertown so as told many times it's almost impossible to carry out.
So, what about giving votes to the boards?
Assuming that for Serenity gliding is 10/10 and planing is 0/10 and in opposite a formula board is gliding 1/10 and planing (I mean easyness) 10/10, what about other boards? I mean actual but also from the past, but not so far and with not actual devices for mastfoot and dagger. Also writing specs could help to understand if it's too much a monster board from the past. So the first from me. Hope this post may interest you.

Starboard Serenity, Sportech, 460x61,5, 257 litres, about 14 kg: planing 0/10 - gliding 10/10; impressions: nice up to 5 knots, fantastic from 5 to 10.
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Old 15th June 2011, 10:57 PM   #2
nakaniko
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Edit: on another forum a (famous) rider told me that in his opinion Serenity is slower than the old Div 2 boards. I'm surprised a bit but according to this and as far as I've never tried a Div 2 board I give only 8/10 to Serenity and 10/10 to the Div 2 boards (even if I find difficult to believe in a board gliding better than Serenity...) So.
Serenity: planing 0/10 - gliding 8/10
Division 2: planing ? - gliding 10/10

Last edited by nakaniko; 16th June 2011 at 04:16 AM.
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Old 16th June 2011, 12:16 AM   #3
Floyd
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I `ve not sailed Serenity but had many years sailing/racing Div 2. In light winds they were unbelievable.In any winds they went upwind as good as dinghys which we had to race against.(We always lost on handicap !! but it was a dinghy club) Cant really see how they could have been improved on. But it was a nightmare in rough water.
Me and a mate once set off to sail around an island off Abersoch (Wales) Ride out was fine; into wind and against swell.Coming back terrible; sailing on a run with rolling swell !!! Mate on his Div1 coped fine; I struggled and was close to giving up.
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Old 16th June 2011, 12:18 AM   #4
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Posted too quick !!??
When wind changed about 40 degrees. Got back fine but learned a lesson !!! Get rid the Div 2 !!
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Old 16th June 2011, 01:01 AM   #5
Screamer
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Nakaniko, it's hard to put this in numbers. If you want to sail in few knots, AND to have ability to plane and have fun when it's stronger, there is not much choice - you need a longboard.
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Old 16th June 2011, 04:16 AM   #6
nakaniko
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Just given away for free to my nephews an old Fanatic Hot Bat 325 and now I desire a Mistral Ventura 2009 343x71,5.Will it glides 70% compared to Serenity?
BTW what was the difference told from Div 1 to Div 2 boards?
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Old 16th June 2011, 04:47 AM   #7
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Div 2 were rounded bottoms; more akin to a small yacht. Div 1 were flat bottoms. There were a couple of boards that sat between the two. Think one was called the Laser Surfsprint. It had a rounded hull in the nose and flattened towards rear.You couldnt race it in either. Well you could in Div 2 but you had no chance but it was banned from Div1)
Most recreational sailors had Div1 but that slowly changed to funboards. Shorter; flat boards but not really competitive in Div1. Div 1 max length was 375cm.Think there was a max volume too.Sucessful Div 1 were F2 lighning.Sailboard sport.etc.

Div 2 had enourmous displacements.as high as 380 litres I (could be wrong with figure but they were massive) They rolled worse than a canoe when you stood on them; you only had any stability with the great big centre board/dagger down. Most were hollow.Amazing technology.Normally coremat construction. (ie two layers of fibreglass seperated by a core of cork. (or similar) after a days sailing you had to empty them just like a dinghy. (They had drain bungs !!!) Lenght was upwards of 380 cm; width around 65 cm.

Those were the days !!!
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Old 16th June 2011, 03:47 PM   #8
nakaniko
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Amazing! Never heard about all this before, thanks Floyd!
At least in something my Serenity is surely better, less problems of rolling on it than you told about Div 2. But very interesting the Div 2 construction, now I'll look around if someone has a board like this in his cellar or garage...
I've found that in some way posters have given a judgement about gliding and planing of Div 1 and Div 2, so a vote I think would be simply like a final summary of a test, like you can see on windsurf magazines; and the same could be for f.e Kona, Phantom 380 and 320, Ahd Tactik, Mistral One Design, and many other (long)boards.
Anyhow for my bad purposes (this is what I call thinking at buying my 9th board): I have a lightweight custom flapper board (nomex core) that is about 263x73 about 150 litres, pheraphs 8 kg, was the the narrow version of the classic 1 mt wide made by this local shaper (Trevisiol); straps on the edge of the board, sharp rails, lowest scoop (sticks even on small waves...), flat hull. But obviously planes easy with HSM Stealth 9,5 and also HSM Superfreak 8,0. Obviously doesn't glide so well in underplaning situations, especially upwind being without centerboard. Here it is:

I've see this Mistral New Ventura from 2009, 343 x 72, 255 litres, centreboard and adjustable mastrack, triconcave to v in the tail, sandwich intec but obviously not carbon, nomex or other pricy materials. Straps in various positions, but more inside the board. It vould be surely glide upwind far better than my flapper, weight not declared but I suppose around 13-14 kg (seeing the volume, similar to my Serenity of 257 lt).
Herer a drawing:

So, as with 9,5 I can plane with about 10 knots or less, what would be the planing threshold for me (90 kg) with the same camless 9,5? A bit or much higher? And gliding compared to Serenity?

Last edited by nakaniko; 16th June 2011 at 03:55 PM.
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Old 16th June 2011, 07:58 PM   #9
Floyd
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Nice one Nakanico.
Your enthusiasm is infectious even over posts. !!
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Old 17th June 2011, 08:36 PM   #10
nakaniko
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Thanks. This because 50% of my brain is always thinking at windsurf, common problem I think around here in this forum.
But the answer: almost same planning level or I'm gonna loose 2 knots? Board is (little?) heavier, but have more litres of volume, even if on a long shape...
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