Old 27th July 2007, 07:12 AM   #1
windsurferdagg
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Default sunken mast track

Alright. My new 2004 hypersonic 111 just showed up. It looks soooo cool!

But my question is... what is with the sunken mast track? Its not level with the deck. What does this give you?

Just wondering what makes my new board tick

there is a pic
http://bp1.blogger.com/_pf0ntQsB6Es/RqklsLdOA_I/AAAAAAAAAHE/i8tWg0_4FO4/s1600-h/DSCN2405.JPG

thanks a lot


Thomas
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Old 27th July 2007, 10:06 AM   #2
Ian Fox
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Default RE: sunken mast track

Hey Thomas,

That's a real worry, could be your board has shrunk around the track sitting in storage since 2004 (??), or maybe was crushed in transit, or even could be the guys in the factory forgot to do up the vent screw and some of the foam used to inflate the HS111 has leaked out.

----------

A simplistic explanation could be that lowering the mast track allows the foot of the sail to sit closer to the deck and thereby more effectivly "closing the gap" more than if the track/base/rig was sitting higher. In practice, that is not nearly as critical as some imagine, although it's also a positive side effect.

More seriously, a recessed mast track is deliberately used to lower the centre of drive (effort) and reduce roll around the board's longitudinal axis created by the rig (mast base).

[[The distance between the (theoretical) longitudinal roll axis of the board and top of the mast foot sitting on the deck effectively creates a theoretical leverage, which side loading forces from the rig can use to (try to..) "twist" (roll) the board around the longitudinal axis. By reducing that distance, the leverage is reduced, and leverage being exponential, even a small reduction in distance produces a noticeable gain when riding the board. Well, you did ask ! ]]

The benefit of recessing the track (mastbase) is more significant on boards that are (relatively) thick (especially relative to width) around the mast track area (such as .... HS111).

You'll notice an improvement in the ride characteristics/handling/control of a board with this feature, especially at high/er speeds sailed close to the limit.

Cheers ~ Ian
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Old 27th July 2007, 08:13 PM   #3
windsurferdagg
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Default RE: sunken mast track

awsome. I am hopfully going to take it for a test drive today. I am interested to feel the difference between the 2003 hypersonic 105 and the 2004 hypersonic 111.

are there any other techniques for this lower center of drive type board? Or do I just sail it like I would any other hypersonic (since they are different than regular boards)

tks a lot ian,

thomas
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Old 27th July 2007, 08:28 PM   #4
Roger
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Default RE: sunken mast track

Hi Thomas,
Get the rig a low as you can at the tack (i.e. no extra extension and pull the downhaul until the tack pulley is practically "two-blocked" with the pulleys on the mast base).
With your 7.6 (or is it 7.4) rig, I'd suggest trying the smaller fin first, and if that doesn't get you going, then the larger fin.
Hypersonics get fast and lively when you run the smallest fin possible.
Start out with the mast foot at the back of the track and see if you can get the HS 111 to tailwalk a little. Then move the mast foot forward slightly until it still very loose, but controllable.
Hope this helps,
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Old 27th July 2007, 11:57 PM   #5
windsurferdagg
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Default RE: sunken mast track

man I can't wait!

You are correct roger. I have a friend with a hyper, and it seems he uses the 42 cm fin for 7.6 and up and works pretty well. I guess I will try the 34 cm fin (its so small compared to my Go 48 cm fin!!!!!). I am guessing with such a small fin I can't just hoof against it to get going. I really have to bare away and build up speed before I feel it kick in right?

My 7.6 does have a very low foot. I love it. My favourite sail by far. I guess it might be difficult getting the board going with a 7.6 ad 32 cm fin though won't it?

tks a lot,

Thomas
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Old 28th July 2007, 12:05 AM   #6
Roger
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Default RE: sunken mast track

Hi Thomas,
No, larger fins do not necessarily get the Hypersonics going a whole lot earlier.
As you say, hed off the wind and get some speed before you gradually load up the fin and I think you'll find you get going as early and as easily as you ever will on the HS 111.
That's the most frustrating thing for me on my Hypersonic 96.
It's often fairly hard to get it onto a plane, and it an take alot of screwing around trying different little "ooches and nuances of trim" and all of a sudden it just take off and continues to do so for the rest of the session. Next day, same wind and conditions, same rig and fin, and it takes off right away, or maybe not. Frustrating, yes, but very nice once you get going because you almost have to fall in to get it to stop planing.
Hope this helps,
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Old 28th July 2007, 12:15 AM   #7
windsurferdagg
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Default RE: sunken mast track

Is your model from 2004 or 2005?

I will see how I fair today. I am taking it out after I sand down the fin base a bit. It will not go fully into the fin box and I do not feel like really forcing it because I hear you can crack fin boxes. I look forward to trying to tack it. Should be fun with such little nose ;-)

I will probably have more questions once I actually sail the thing! Waited 2 weeks for it to come.

thanks again,

Thomas
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Old 28th July 2007, 08:01 AM   #8
Roger
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Default RE: sunken mast track

Hi Thomas,
Do you have a file (rather than sandpaper)?
Best way to fit that fin is to rub soap on the fin root (yes, a bar of common bath tub soap like you take a shower with).
When you rub the soap on the fin root, it will be dull and whitish looking.
Put the fin root in the fin box, and put a little hand pressure on the fin.
When you pull it back out, you will see spots where the dull whitish soap has turned shiny and black (the underlying color of the fin).
Use a file to take these "high spots" off the fin root and your fin will drop into place very quickly.
Remember to leave the fin root about 1/64" proud of the bottom of your board (don't keep filing until it comes out flat with the bottom of the board).
This last little bit is the "draw" on the front and rear tapers of the fin root and fin box that makes a good tight fit when you pull the root into full engagement with the fin screws.
If it seems like the fin is not fitting on the lower half of the rear of the fin root (the half closest to the bottom of the board) take a flashlight and look into the fin box and see if there's a "glob" of epoxy there to keep the fin higher in the box.
Cobra sometimes does this, and it's then better to take a very small half round or rat tail file and file off the high spot that the glob presents to see if you can get more of the front and rear tapers to fit tightly.
Hope this helps,
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Old 3rd August 2007, 07:41 AM   #9
windsurferdagg
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Default RE: sunken mast track

WOOOOOOOOOOOOW... HOLY CRAP!!!!

As you suggested, I sailed the hypersonic 111 with the 34 cm fin while juiced on the 7.6 naish redline. I am at a loss for words. Once you figure out that baring away a lot REALLY helps early planing and getting into the straps on that board, its crazy. I could plane super fast and before people who were even on carve 133's and 8.5s! I could outstrip anyone and could really get dialed in. What a thrill!

its kind of scary baring away though. We had some semi big chop for 16-20 knots and I was hesitant about sinking the nose and me killing myself ;-)

I tried a couple of jibes too. It was fun, I always had a lot of entrance speed and almost made it around a couple of times!

Tacking was difficult though. I fell quite a few times in the choppier gusts. But it pointed so high upwind, I didn't really care. I was just suprised at how much physical effort it takes to sail. I was exhausted after 3 hours sailing! USually I don't even have to come off the water, but now, I take breaks every 30 minutes or so.

My questions are...

1. I found that I spun out quite a few times. People said that it was the weeds that caused them. Is this true? I don't wanna try breaking my speed record (which was set today :-D) knowing that spin out could indeed happen with my technique right now. if it was the weeds, than I can live with that, its not usually that windy.

2. Jibing was pretty fun, but do you have any solid tips? I found I really had to lift with the foot still in the strap to get a tighter turn.

3. What do you describe as an ideal stance for overpowering conditions. Do I need to worry about the nose diving? or can I just sail like I would with a 32 cm longer board...

Thanks a lot Roger, hope you get better soon,

Thomas

PS HYPERSONICS ARE AMAZING!!!!!! I took a break and let two other very experienced sailors try it and they came off the water stoked, amazed and best of all... WANTING ONE TOO!
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Old 3rd August 2007, 11:02 AM   #10
Roger
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Default RE: sunken mast track

Hi Thomas,
I guess this means you like the Hypersonic, right?
I think the correct term is perhaps "bearing off".
You can tack the Hypersonic, yes, but why would you want to do this?
Unless you are up against some large or immovable obstacle (hull of a ship is pretty large, and a concrete or rip rap " breakwater or breakwall is pretty immovable) you generally do not need to tack the Hypersoinc at all.
Remember when we discussed keeping your weight behind the mast foot and "stepping over" the mast while it's raked as far back as it will go (actually resting on the board above the upwind rear footstrap is a really good position). Try this technique on the Hypersonic and you may soon be doing planing tacks.
Learning planing tacks, BEFORE you get dialed in on fully planing jibes would be awesome, right?
As far as jibing, keep the nose up. If you shift your weight forward at all, the nose DROPS and the board STOPS.
So, don't try to do "tight" jibes. If you keep the nose up and "roll" your board into the jibe without shifting your weight forward, the board will lose almost no speed on the way in,
As soon as the board really starts carving (it does this on the bottom shape (i.e. the wings at the back) ) then you can roll the board a little more to tighten your jibe up, but trying to "stuff" a Hypersonic into a tight jibe never works very well for me.
And, yes, try strap to strap jbes where you leave your old front foot in the strap as you"roll" your board into the entry of the jibe. Press down with your back foot over near the lee rail and well behind the front footstrap (so the nose doesn't drop due to you shifting weight forward)
and pull up with the old front foot in the old upwind footstrap.
Get it right and it gives you alot more control.
As far as the spin out, lighten up on the fin abit, and rail the board a bit more to leeward to crank upwind.
And, if there are any weeds at all, get a good weed fin for your Hyper.
Hypers are a little less "affected" by surface weeds as the complex shape helps to divert weeds away from the front of the fin, but any weed on your fin pretty much guarantees spin out at some point.
As far as "stuffing" the nose into chop, I too was always worried about that with the Hypers. but it never happened.
Sure, a 2 or 3 foot boat wake is not something you want to drive into head on, but normal chop is easily handled by the shape under the nose of the Hypers. It only "appears" that the nose is practically in the water because the top of the board is so flat nose to tail. All the "rocker" that you would normally see in the nose of the board is still there, but it's all underneath the nose.
Great news that you are having such a good time with this new board.
Hope this helps,
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