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Old 14th April 2008, 02:40 PM   #1
nageleri
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Default Advice on changing to new slalom shapes

Hi there,

Need some advice on changing kit to the new slalom shapes.
I have been sailing for a number of years on RRD Slalom Racing 81 (year 99 - volume 100 ltrs) and RX1 6.1 and 7.2 fully powered up. Been a joy to sail this board as it is blisteringly quick although not very forgiving.

For lightwind days I am on formula kit.

I am a good intermediate sailor and weigh 83kgs and have upgraded my sails to RS racing by NP in sizes 6.2 and 7.2.

If I wanted to replicate the same set up would a Isonic 111 or 101 be better?

I am also contemplating filling the hole to formula kit by getting a 8m2 sail with potentially a larger volume slalom board perhaps Isonic 133.

When the wind really picks to stronger the 6.2m2 I move onto wave kit.

Advice appreciated.
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Old 14th April 2008, 04:49 PM   #2
Screamer
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Hi Nageleri

If you are comparing only volume, you will end up getting much bigger board than you need. New slaloms have MUCH bigger widths and tail widths, so they will carry bigger sails than your current board (what are its dimensions?). You mention you want to replicate the same setup. For your current sails, even iS96/59 would fit the bill, if you're well powered up. If you go for an 8m sail, iS111 will be ideal, unless it's very holey 8m wind so you have to schlog a lot of the time.
Can you find a demo or borrow an iSonic? You won't feel right at home at first, you'll probably need several sessions to adjust.

Edit: If you already have a 7.2, then an 8.0 would be close IMHO. You could go for 8.5-9.0, and then iS96+iS122 would cover it all well. Just a thought.

Last edited by Screamer; 14th April 2008 at 04:54 PM.
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Old 14th April 2008, 05:19 PM   #3
Jean-Marc
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Agree with Screamer. iS133 too big with an 8.0 sail, but is sweeter with a 9.x for an 85 kg rider.

Cheers !

JM
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Old 14th April 2008, 06:27 PM   #4
Jean-Marc
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More hints : on the french forum, MAD (185 cm x 80 kg) is using iS101 with 5.8/6.8/7.8 sails. Rémi (85 kg) is using iS111 with 6.7/7.7/9.0 sails.

Check out iS96/iS101 discussion with 6.3-7.0/7.5 sails :
http://www.star-board.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2478

Cheers !

JM
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Old 15th April 2008, 04:13 AM   #5
Chris Pressler
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Hi Nagelerei,
you should go for the iSonic 101. You can carry sails, which are bigger than yours, too and your actual sizes will fit excellent, too. Especially the 7,2 will work great. If your plans are to sails many days on the 8,0 you could consider to go for the 111.

Cheers,
Chris

www.chrispressler.com
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Old 15th April 2008, 02:38 PM   #6
geo
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Hi Nagelerei,

my experience on wider iSonics is limited, but I know what you are talking about. I bought an RRD 281 in '97 and happily sailed it until it was stolen in Summer '99. Then I replaced it with an RRD 278 that I used until Summer '05 before moving to more modern designs.
I would frame the problem two ways: size, and style.

My first thought is that if you are used to the super fast, unforgiving ride of your beast, wou will be bored to death on almost ANY modern slalom board, exp. iSonic 101 and bigger. Even a Sonic95 feels tame compared with the RRD278, much much more so when compared to the 281. Second thought, the ability you developed so far on that beast risks to go wasted! From "style" point of view, if you are looking for speed and nervousness that will somehow remind those of the 281, probably the right choice would be an iS96 or even 86.

When I started sailing the 278, I found it definitely slower than the 281. I asked for advice to the shapers, and they told me that Anders Bringdal himself asked for an easier board to ride than the 281, because he needed to concentrate less on the ride, and more on the race itself; even at the cost of giving up some speed; and so the 278 was born... just to remark to which point the 281 is a very uncommon design.

Size wise, I think the Sonic95 (and probably iS94/96) rides slightly "smaller" than the 281, not due to size, but to efficiency. The 281 was not the first to plane but, once there, it would't stop; while the S95 requires constant sail drive (probably due to lower hull profile in the mast foot - front straps area, that makes for easier planing with big sails but catches earlier). So to cover the same range you would probably need bigger sails (move to 6.5 + 7.5?) and/or even bigger boards (101/111). This of course will give you plenty more upwind power, and probably much more TOW.
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Old 15th April 2008, 04:51 PM   #7
nageleri
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Hi guys,

Thanks very much for all the helpful comments. It seems that this has been a topic which has been debated quite a bit.
It is always difficult since the shapes have changed so much and sail sizes have a broader range. I remember the day when 7.5m was considered large!
I can definitely relate to Geo's remarks as he has sailed the exact (281) and next edition of the RRD which I still sail.
Based on comments above it seems that the more appropriate smaller sail size would be 6.5m rather than 6.0m due to the requirement to have a constant drive.
Do you find that most sailors riding Is96/Is101 have a 6.5m sweet spot rather than smaller 6.0m when fully powered up?
On a safety note, when the wind does disappear will I be up to my knees in water with the Is96/Is101 weighing 83kgs with sail or can you make it back home? Modern shapes have wider and more evenly distributed volume on back end of the board vs older narrower shapes.
This sometimes happens where I sail as the winds are thermal .. do have a tendency to disappear rather quickly at the end of the day and sometimes we can be a little bit far out ... hence I like to get back home in one piece.
This was never easy on the RRD, but just wanted to check.
Thanks once again for the comments and this forum really is great in sharing experiences and does help with some of these queries.
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Old 15th April 2008, 05:25 PM   #8
geo
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Nageleri,
if this can help: I used my Sonic95 with 6.6 and 7.6 TR-2 and 6.3 and 7.0 TR-3. The sweet spot size was the 6.6. 6.3 is OK but in such conditions the board feels big, anyhow stays nicely controllable; with typical 7.0 winds larger boards can be more competitive, unless fully powered up; can hold 7.6, but larger boards are definitely more competitive in such conditions.
As a reference: I used the 281 with 6.6 Simmer SC-4 and very briefly with 6.9 SC-5; the 278 with 6.6 and 6.9 SC-5. Sweet spot of the 281 to me was 6.9.

Last edited by geo; 15th April 2008 at 06:54 PM.
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Old 16th April 2008, 12:04 AM   #9
Ken
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Nageleri,

Your situation isn't too different than mine. I sail formula and have a 105 L bump and jump board. I wanted to fill the gap in between the two boards, so I got an iS 111, with the idea that I would use it with my 7.4, but would also use my 8.4 and 6.6 from time to time.

I weigh 80 kg and I find that 100 - 105 liters is my sink / float limit. I too get becalmed on occasion, so having a floating, uphaulable board is nice. The iS 111 is actually 108 liters and is sweet with the 7.4. I sail with TR-3's and 4's.
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Old 21st April 2008, 03:35 AM   #10
davide
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nageleri View Post
Hi there,

Need some advice on changing kit to the new slalom shapes.
I have been sailing for a number of years on RRD Slalom Racing 81 (year 99 - volume 100 ltrs) and RX1 6.1 and 7.2 fully powered up. Been a joy to sail this board as it is blisteringly quick although not very forgiving.

For lightwind days I am on formula kit.

If I wanted to replicate the same set up would a Isonic 111 or 101 be better?

Advice appreciated.
I would personally go to with 101 (or 96), that still is a wide board. As others have commented max-width (and width at 30cm) is a very important factor and volumes are less so, especially when they are quite off (for example, the 101 I think is a real 96).

If you do not want to change your style too much an alternative is a Carbon Art Slalom 58 or 62. CAs have an impeccable pedigree (Phil McGain designed). I recently bought a CA SL 52 87L. The board is quite narrow, with volume distribution strongly toward the tail, and a thin (but "boxy") front. It is excellent: floaty, very fast, starts a jibe with tiny amounts of pressure (in what I think is a big advantage in respect to wide boards), and is extremely controllable in chop. Outline is more "traditional" but it is as much a huge improvement in respect to old slalom boards as the new isonic are (in my case direct comparison is with a Sonic W52 and Kinetic 58 UL). Range is a comfortable 5.0-6.5, at my 68Kg I took it out in powered up 5.1 without any problem.

I am still debating what to get as a 100L board and my choice is between the Isonic 101/96 and a CA SL 58 or 62. Those.

CA SL 58 or 62, would be just the right board for your 6.1-7.2

Last edited by davide; 22nd April 2008 at 09:23 PM.
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