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Old 19th January 2009, 05:30 PM   #1
Ulf
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Default Kode finbox

I know the power verse tuttle/US debate has risen a number of times over the years in Kombats. I own a Freestyle wave now that is not Starboard basically motivated by this issue.
Having used powerbox on over 20 sails this spring/summer I am in full agreeance with the people saying Power is better, especially in the 90 to 105 ltr range.
I have a Kode 112 that is tuttle but really wish it was Powerbox so as to have a consistent fin system.
I wonder how many non Starboard riders would buy these boards if they had a Powerbox fin sytem.
It is way stronger than US and gives a lot more drive. My Kombats of the past had multiple fin replacments because the US snapped behind the screw due to side on pressure and on one occasion a sand bank.
I won't go back while the fins are US.
Having ridden both now I feel I can make an informed opinion, and really can't understand why Starboard decision makers don't use them.
Crazy stuff.
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Old 19th January 2009, 07:37 PM   #2
mim
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Default hi...

if you say you already had multiple fin exchange, than it would be much easier for you to change the finbox to Powerbox...it is not a big deal.

Have fun!
Ciao Michal.
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Old 19th January 2009, 07:46 PM   #3
Ola_H
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I respect your opinion but for me personally it's the opposite for two reasons.

1. On a board that has any chance of seeing waves I wouldn't want a fixed position box. On small and medium Kodes I run my wave fins severas centimeters forwards of where I put a freeride fin. If you buy the board fo only one type of sailing, of course you can have one perfect fin position. But on a crossover boards you can not. It will be a compromise between tuning range on one hand and ease of use on the other hand (and max fin size).

2. I regularly hit rocks where I wave sail and smash up fins. Only once I broke a fin tab in the last 10 years of sailing. I had only one powerbox wave board. I hit a rock with it one time which broke the box AND damaged the deck of the board which resulted in a big complicated repair. So, my personal experience is just the opposite.

I can understand powerboxes are popular on freestyle boards where you don't need the tuning range since they are easier to use (saving you 20 seconds or something when mounting). Same things for small boards that are used only for freeride (which would apply to people that buy a fsw board to use only in that type of sailing). But in the whole scheme of things, I think the powerbox is just a bad idea, trading strength (relative a tuttle) and tuning ability (relative a us-box) for a tiny bit of extra ease of use.

But thats just my own personal opinion. Let's hear what other say.
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Old 20th January 2009, 02:52 AM   #4
Farlo
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Hi Ulf & Ola, for me the best box ever was Tiga's conical box (the last one with the hand-screw, both robust and convenient). This been said, isn't that possible to put wave fins forwards and freeride fins backwards in the head, so that one fixed box would accomodate both styles? In most cases the head is several cm larger than the fin. Going further, what about a head (let's say Tuttle) with a deep slot to fit blades at multiple positions, like a US box but pressing from the sides? I've got several fins with box adaptors and never broke any.

Last edited by Farlo; 20th January 2009 at 03:04 AM.
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Old 20th January 2009, 05:04 AM   #5
Ola_H
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This was actually ow it was done on the original Starboard Aero which is the predecessor of the big Kodes (but with more wave orientation, I would say). The mega big wave fin (similar in shape to the Drake Naturals) was placed forward in the head, with an inch or so sticking out in front of the head. A functional compromise, but the problem is that is is difficult to get a good fit between the "free" end of the fin and the bottom of the board. I had some strange sounds coming from the fin and ANY weed in the water would get stuck.
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Old 20th January 2009, 05:29 AM   #6
Ulf
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Smile

MiM I replace my boards each year and the trade would be greatly reduced.

Farlo.. I don't the fixbox you mean, is it like a trimbox?? Started sailing in1995.

Ola H ... This year ola I bought two FSW boards to try something different. I also got a selection of fins in G10 from the manufacturer. I noticed the smaller were set forward against the head like you mentioned in the last threat but not beyond.
I ride them on waves and jump going out , and occasionally let the board run fast in freeride mode. Being 87 Kg i haven't (yet) felt the boards were not loose enough on the waves and further more I haven't had the spin out problem I used to get with the evo and kombats. I could be due to a surfing history as I load up the rear foot a lot more than i should. It's very hard to break old habits.
You raise some very good points. Being very lazy and always in a rush to get out I find the powerbox excellent as there is no mucking around with that little screw, and I can rig very quickly now.
Maybe S arboard might make them in both, like futura comes in two colours.

Do you use the stock fins or something else?
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Old 20th January 2009, 11:04 AM   #7
James
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I would definitely be more likely to buy starboard freeride and fsw boards if they used powerbox. The reason my quiver is currently 87l F2, 106l Exocet, and 220l Kona is because they all use powerbox. Also, I don't like the idea of extra drag and cavitation and fin-wiggling with the exposed slot of a US box.

I guess I can see the point of US box for dedicated wave boards, and tuttle / deep-tuttle box for dedicated race boards, but I wish everything else were powerbox.

Last edited by James; 20th January 2009 at 11:11 AM.
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Old 20th January 2009, 04:00 PM   #8
Farlo
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Hi Ulf, last Tiga's conical box is a kind of more open Tuttle with a transversal pin in the front. The head has a slot for the pin and only one hand-screw in the back. Placing or removing the fin is much easier due to the open angle. Trimbox is also an excellent design although feeling "looser" than Tuttle of Power. Both conical or trimbox have only one back screw, thus no interference with footstraps. On some boards you can't use the inner/central footstrap positions because of the front/middle fin screw. I wonder why concepts like conical or trimbox have been given up as these were superior by far, excepted for dedicated wave or race boards as mentioned by James.

Last edited by Farlo; 20th January 2009 at 08:09 PM.
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Old 20th January 2009, 04:33 PM   #9
Waiting4wind
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I have two FSW boards. In that category SB doesn't come into consideration due to the US box.
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Old 20th January 2009, 08:34 PM   #10
mim
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what does it mean in the cathegory....?

if you have such a board...you ride either waves (than US-box is pretty fine). If you are freestyling, OK.

I would go for freestyle-wave because you can get a board with a volume above 100 liter, that can be used for waves by some heavyweight (like me) or used on a lake for high wind blasting (for strong wind I have PureAcid, US-box and it is just fine).

No experiemne with freestyling, but PWA guys are doing fine on US-box as well.

PS: There is this discussion why not Powerbox, well starboard still is good positioned, because they only have two systems, and the other brands three.
They have US-box (pure wave) and tuttle (racing) as well.

Ciao M.
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